Alternative Fuels and Technologies
City Hall
Which shows the most promise? (please read below first)
Alternative Fuels and Technologies
Which shows the most promise? (please read below first)
- Hydrogen
- 5 votes
- hybrid
- 6 votes
- electric
- 4 votes
- ethanol
- 4 votes
- biodeisel
- 0 votes
- get off your fat ass and walk!
- 5 votes
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When gas prices rise, people's thoughts naturally jump to alternative fuel sources. as i put $30 for 11 gal. of gas into my car today. i thought about all the new ways of transport. hydrogen, gas/electric, electric, ethanol, and biodeisel.
and i decide to see what you would be willing to get.
Hydrogen:
ok a lot of people say that this is the way to go. an while it is a good mode clean mode of transportation it does have a draw back. Water vapor. this could cause a change in climate even more than the supposed global warming. too much water vapor in the atmosphere can have an adverse effect on climate. maybe even cause a cataclysmic climate shift (day after tommorrow) but thats just the scenario if the fuel cell actually worked, but it doesn't. it's Thermodynamically impossible with the current technology.
Hybrid:
this may be the one with the most promise. the only draw back i could find was the price of the batterys if they go bad. the back of the car is a battery "pack" (basically one big battery) that gives power to the electric motors and stores the energy. the price can run several thousand if it goes bad.
Electric:
The problem with this is, of course, electricity generation. but i have a designed a perpetual motion and electricity generator.(i'm still trying to get a patent on it. id tell you guys but...well, ya know)
Ethanol:
this also shows promise. basically the same as a car engine (with a few moderations of course) and it is relatively, clean buring.
Biodeisel: cheaper. thats basically it.
well, what do you guys think is the most promising? come on. id like to have a really good descusion about this
here i a really good chart on alt-fuel. you need adbe acrobat to run it
http://media.popularmechanics.com/documents/Fuel_of_the_Future-e852.pdf
The true drawback of hydrogen technology was the cost of extracting it through electrolysis was expensive. However, an inventor seems to have found a way to create an inexpensive means of that processes.
http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2602.html
Its quite interesting and seems to have potential.
Etanol is really taking off in Africa. They have started building plants in the corn growing areas and things are looking promising in terms of progress. Our fuel prices are going through the roof so the sooner we figure out an alternative the better in my opinion.
i think the best to go is hybrid if we're talking about near future. the thing is, it's expensive and they'd need to perfect it to a T to prevent wasting all that money. i guess same could be said for all of them, especially for hydro, which i was leaning towards as well. but then you mentioned water vapor. yes, it would be good for small scales but i see the problems it would cause if its used in a large scale.
yeah a small number of hydrogen would be ok. but there is one problem i dont see why they cant fix. use the water over again or atleast get it out of the air. put a condenser on the car and draw out as much vapor as possible (into a waste tank or something), then release the exhaust in an upward direction.
Hybrid is the best path forward at this time. A combination of proven relatively inexpensive tech. As the batteries in Hybrids improve and other alternatives become mature then they may gradually push the hybrids into the minority.
You are correct in identifying that water vapor is a greenhouse gas. Infact, it is more potent in terms of absorption and radiation of infrared than CO2 or other greenhouse gases.
Yet consider that the atmosphere is sufficently cool enough to cause excess water vapor to condense and form into clouds. Depending on the thickness and altitude the cloud forms, visible light is reflected back into space and less is able to be absorbed to heat the Earths surface. There are some theories that suggest an increase in cloud formations will offset the warming trends associated with global warming (short of hypothesizing the cause, thats already on other threads). Yet again that is dependent upon where the cloud form (altitude) and its thickness. The whispy, feathery, or thin sheet like clouds that we find above 10,000 ft allows energy to reach the Earths surface, thus net warming will occur. The thicker and low level clouds that bring steady rain reflects such energy back into space, again a cooling effect will take place.
Well I think hybrid has a lot of potential and could be used in the future. It looks like it's the most ecologic-friendly method and the concept it represents sound good overall. I think the price will get lower with time, when this technology is studied more and new ways of production will be found.
I'm gonna go with hybrid.
Build Nuclear Power Plants to make cheap electricty and go with electric vehicles.
Also get off your fat ass and walk!
That would solve a lot of unrelated problems too!
Very true my friend.
I think it too dangerous cz you must have shield that can prevent us from radioactive substance.
I think he is refering to more nuclear power facilities suplanting older coal fire plant to produce cheaper electricity to juice up electric cars.
if we have battery stations (like gas stations) then we wont need a way to generate our own power for our cars
Batteries need to be charged somehow.?.
There is no battery fairy that waves a magic wand and "poof" here's a freshly charged battery
what are you talking about?! im talking about have recharge stations for when the battery runs down. instead of having an internal power generator. if we can design batteries that can hold a much more powerful charge than the ones we have today then we can just have the recharge stations. like those little rc cars that you charge at a little docikg station
I think both Hydrogen and Electric are best choices for the future.
A hybrid car is very fuel efficient, but that doesn't change the fact that it burns fuel. Considering that there are millions of cars on Earth, even if we were able to cut back as much as three quarters of current consumption rates, we still won't stop global warming (but slowing it down is better than doing nothing) The good thing about hybrid cars though, is that it provides a good transition into hydrogen or electric cars. There's no we the world can replace tens of thousands of millions of cars in a short period.
So why do I think hydrogen and electric cars are the best? Hydrogen burns clean and only pumps out water vapours (which can be filtered in a way or so) and as mentioned earlier by someone (sorry forgot name) it condenses in high air and blocks some sunlight (hopefully not too much). And I forgot where I seen this but liquid hydrogen can be generated with power from the sun (a way to store solar energy).
Electric cars are quiet and clean. The only problems are that the electricity might be generated from a polluting power plant elsewhere (but that's another problem of its own, countries need to develop renewable energies) and they run out of power pretty quickly. The idea of charging stations are great, but I have a better idea. Have stations with company/city or country-owned, precharged batteries that are made compatible for all cars, and people can go there, return the ran-out battery, and take out another pack of battery for a fee. This way there will be no waiting time. (Sort of like the local video store?
or the
Japanese noodle deliveries where they deliver a whole bowl of noodles, and you
return the bowls later on...)
anyways... just a thought
Yeah that does make more sense now that i think about it. that way you dont have a long line for recharging and it will probably save money too.
Sorry. I agree we should have better batteries and places to exchange them.
We still need cheap NUCLEAR POWER to provide the elecrticity for the batteries.
The least "Carbon Footprint Solution" of all choices.
LPG is a form of gas right? Hybrid cars can take them right? LPG is alot cheaper than general unleaded? So, what is the big deal with hybrid cars? Gas/LPG cars have been around for along time. Taxis use them alot and they have been around for a long time too. Same with public transport. Cars can be made to use LPG only. I dont see why they need to have unleaded fuel as well.
Okay, let's start with the basics. Well, you're right. There are many other alternatives you can use for transportation. Alas, some of the energies/alternatives are basically bad for the world. Hmm, well, hydrogen does sound good, but like you said, it causes changes in the climate and probably as well as it can affect global warming. So, I wouldn't like using anything that'll affect the world as the environment around us. I know it's going to be used one day or has it been begun? The usage of hydrogen? About using the alternative with hybrids. Well, yes it may show promise to the people and it does sound good, but the drawback on it may affect a lot of people due to the fact that it may cost them more money to get it a new one or at least replace it. But is there a limit that which a hybrid can go up to before breaking down? Like, how long can, let's say, a hybrid car can go before going empty? Electricity...isn't that the same way of using gas unless of course of how it's used? I mean, in order to create electricity, one must burn, I think are chemicals that which cause the climate to change. Thus, yet, right now, we all are causing this. Alas, we can't help it because we need electricity. Unless of course, someone found an alternative of using a computer, TV, microwaves, etc. Anyway, electricity, to me, doesn't sound good therefore I do not like the idea of using electricity. Alas, I may change my mind on it if I were able to know more about using it and etc. Okay, about Ethanol....as you just said. It's like a car engine with a few moderations and it's clean burning. Well, it affects the environment and the climate, correct? Well, this sounds nice and all and I guess it's okay that people can use this alternative to get around places. So, I approve of this idea in spite that it still affect the environment, but only a bit. *I think o_O* Biodeisel? What exactly is that? I know it's cheap, but what is it? Is it like gasoline or what? Can someone tell me what this is? I have no idea.
~Additional Information From Reading Earlier Posts~
Oh? So, the alternative for hydro is that if you were able to use it, it'll still be a problem to the environment and further more? Um, so does it use a small scale or a large scale? It's a large scale, right? 'cause it needs a lot of energy to correctly function a vehicle. Right?
*reads most of the posts on this thread*
Okay, I've read at least most of the posts made on this thread and so far, my mind goes on the nuclear power which help generate electricity, yet in a cheaper, affordable sort of way. Well, a few weeks ago, my history class had a debate on whether to use nuclear power as an alternative or not. But on this one, we were discussing the pros and cons of nuclear power. Well, let me see if I can remember at least some of the stuff that said. *thinks* Hmm...well, in this debate, I came on the side of the cons of using nuclear power and thus what I heard from my group is that nuclear power isn't the way to go because it affects the environment (I must of said this like a few times) and it isn't the safest to use. But the pro group said that nuclear power is the way to go 'cause it'll alternately change the way we live and function and for a fact that Japan have nuclear power plants, but they aren't able to use it for war and stuff 'cause there was a law or some treaty that they signed that they cannot have any nuclear weapons and a smaller army and stuff. Eh, I know this is off the topic, but I'm trying to make a point here. Anyway, the pro group said that there weren't so many breakdowns in nuclear power plants now then it was back then. I'm not exactly sure how many breakdowns have occured, but I was pretty sure there weren't that many. Even though I don't like to admit it, but I guess the nuclear power is a way to go. Thus I support the use of electricity. (I probably said I wouldn't like the use of this idea, but I guess I changed my mind.) So, this is all I have to say. By the way, this was an interesting topic. I like hearing the pros and cons about these alternatives that we can replace gasoline with. ^^
i heard that they foung a way to make gas out of corn. the guy on the news said to buy stocks in john deer immeadiatly. something in the corn is found in gas. and every farmer needs to buy tracktors and stuff. the most popular right now is john deer.
Well there is one issue with that currently. You see today's battery technology would make that change out relatively hazardous considering teh amount of material to be replaced and the potential energy contained within. Now if they manage to improve the storage devices and drive systems this wil be a great idea. Kinda like having a power pack for your car just like your cordless drill.
Amen brother. That would solve two problems fuel and rising obesity and laziness.
Yes they did and its called ethanol. ITs probably the most renewable form of actual fuel but it requires huge tracts of land dedicated to only corn growth and its still not prefect since it requires additional energy to make the ethanol from the corn. As for buying stocks in alternative energy companies I'd go with the larger companies like GE (their new locomotives are alot greener with teh new power generation systems) and the companies that produce raw materials and finished products for solar, wind, and other forms of energy collection.