Quote by shoujoboy
Religious historians may consider the bible a history book, but historians that
require fact usually question much of what is said in the Bible. Remember, just
because you want something to be true, doesn't make it so.
religious historians? i don't think so. assuming that you read all the comment
in the thread that you post in, i remembered that one of the MT member did
mention as well about this point? and don't forget geological proof have been
found for biblical events.
personally, i feel that your points are more of personal opinion than facts.
scholars studying religions and geologist have found much proof regarding the
events in the Bible, but i admit that to your credit, many are still in the
dark.
and aside from that, i curious to know what makes you think the Christian God is
arrogance.
The answer to your question is simple: One must question the storied logic of an
all-knowing, all-powerful god that creates faulty humans and blames them for
their mistakes.
Look at it from this perspective. A mother and father is essentially "the
creator" for their children. They raise them and love them. So what if that
child reached age 20 and they didn't like how he/she turned out... so they
decided to kill him? That is essentially the God you speak of. He creates humans
which have faults and then if he doesn't like the way they turned out, casts
them into hell. Hmmm.
Not only that, but as I've previously mentioned, if I accomplish something in
life it isn't because of me, but of God. HE gave me the strength. HE gave me the
wisdom. HE made it happen. If I don't praise and worship him for the things HE
did, I'm doomed for hell. Hmmm.
I can give to charity, serve my country and be a wonderful husband and father,
but because I didn't believe in him, I'm doomed for hell. I can live the life of
a saint but with the purpose of helping humans because I am a human, but not
worship him, I'm doomed to hell. Hmmm.
i see that your concept of going to hell is all messed up? i'll guess that its
because your parents drill the "how to go to hell" thing into your
head?
but my concept of going to hell is different from what you thought. for me, you
go to hell is when you don't believe in God or stop believing him, or even
believe theres God but don't accept him. sure, humans are indeed very faulty,
but even if you believe in God and accepts him even in the last second in your
life, you still get your ticket to heaven.
trust me, believing in God and accepting him a few moments later is a very hard
thing to do, because you cannot lie to yourself. and, what about the sins? i
believe sins are unavoidable but as a Christian it is our obligation to obey the
10 commandments, theres no whatsoever punishment for breaking it, but still we
have to obey the best we can the 10 commandments. as for charities and
voluntarisms, they are also on free will basis, even though they are on God's
orders. that is why being a Christian needs a lot of discipline and that is why
many people leave Christianity. and that is why i won't force my beliefs onto
anyone, because you may be a Christian in name, but deep inside you are still
not.
from my eyes, accomplishments and wisdoms are from God, as do failures. I see
everyone has their own purposes set by God, even little things; for example,
this might be God's will for me to tell you all these. and in fact this may be
his will for you to tell me why you deny Him.
Well, this is what I believe of God, as I have many years ago. I grew up in a
Christian family, but my parents don't force their beliefs onto me. I accept God
and believed in Him on my own accord. and in this sense, i don't see him as
arrogant.
anyway, since you told me what you think of God, i told you what i think of him
also
Quote: This theory you have just
deemed as wrong, is still being researched. This possibility, along with many
others, are still being researched as to the origins of man. Fossil records,
historical writings etc still require study and discussion. Yet, you think that
just because you say so that his theory is incorrect? That dear girl is called
arrogance, something your God seems to have taught you all too well.
what researches, for the first who tought bout that theory
said himself that he's wrong. and if we evolved from apes, how can apes are
still here in this world? i dont think that any animals could evolve into
completely different form, like their tails and brains, we're lot smarter than
them. and yeah, i know that horses long time ago were as short as cat's size.
have you found something like that now? cats and tigers or a husky and a wolf
look similar, but they are not the same. oh, maybe you should think that some
humans in the past turned into apes. you know what scientists do? they're making
theories, and they want their theories can be used in life. that's what their
job is. said a profesor from a university of america
Priincess, do you know the purpose of theories? Are you familiar with the simple
concept of the scientific method? You start with a hypothesis. That is
essentially an idea that you think makes sense. Once that idea has some kind of
relevance, it becomes theory. Theories are then studied in great detail and are
either proven, thereby becoming a law, or more often than not disproven.
Yes, evolution is a theory. The Big Bang is a theory. But instead of "I
have a good idea, this is the absolute truth", science aims to
prove/disprove those said theories. Religion on the other hand says "heres
this book, what it says goes. There's no proof necessary you just must accept
what is in here and that is all." There are millions of possibilites as to
the origins of man. We could be a science experiment for some other
civilization. We could be the result of a fart from a magical being millions of
years ago. We may be decended from rocks. Who knows? You don't, I don't, nobody
does.
But these are questions that can't simply be answered with a book written
millenia ago. These are questions that must be investigated.
Quote by priincessand if we evolved
from apes, how can apes are still here in this world? i dont think that any
animals could evolve into completely different form, like their tails and
brains, we're lot smarter than them. and yeah, i know that horses long time ago
were as short as cat's size. have you found something like that now? cats and
tigers or a husky and a wolf look similar, but they are not the same. oh, maybe
you should think that some humans in the past turned into apes. you know what
scientists do? they're making theories, and they want their theories can be used
in life. that's what their job is. said a profesor from a university of
america
Apes are in this world because according to evolution animals evolve to have the
characteristics best suited to their environment. Apes can live in jungles and
most people couldn't survive. On the other hand apes cannot live in deserts
whereas people have learned how to survive in them. Think of it this way why are
there so many colors of birds? In wooded areas its more beneficial for birds
that can blend in better so they can avoid being eaten. In arctic regions it
favors birds that are white so they blend with the snow. Even people vary
greatly depending on the environment they live in. Africans have dark skin so
that they don't burn in the harsh sun. Natives in south america are short and
have barrel chests so they can survive in high altitudes. I could go on and on
about this.
Btw seriously get MS word or something. It's hard to take you seriously with
such glaring errors.
^actually, white skins fare better under the sun; black absorbs, white reflects.
thats why "white" skin don't sweat as much as "black" skin
under a hot sun.
anyway, this discussion is just going around in circles.
Except that white skin burns under the sun while black skin is less effected.
Not only that, but sweating is a good thing in hot environments. Sweat cools
your body as it evaporates, so by your logic that would also give the advantage
to black skin.
Quote by AaragIf I recalled some people
honored more than one god in the bible as for example
the greeks,japanese,and indians how could anyone explain
that
as for your question, if you still do follow ups on this thread, i'll tell you
that it's not some people in the ancient world, it's everyone. they either go
for polytheism or animal worship. the Jews are the first to embrace
monotheism.
like all polytheisms, people marvel at the greatness of the sky(etc) the stars,
the mountains, etc, and therefore made gods out of them. (on the path of
"animal" worship, those are usually not referred as gods, but rather
as spirits) so theres where zeus, ashura, ra, quetzalcoatl, and such come
from.
in fact, change their set of gods all too often, and their myth explains the
change via "overthrow". zeus overthrow his father kronus, earlier
kronus overthrow his father ophienous(? i think this is the name)
as for japanese, their gods are quite similiar to the gods from china, er lang,
guan ying, and such, until buddhism came about. after that, like the chinese,
they mixed their gods with buddhism. and as for the chinese gods, most of them
are famous heroes and generals in the past so great that the people made them
god.
as for hinduism, i dont remember the details, so if you're curios, wikipedia is
there for you .
-We'll technically science doesnt predict we evolved from apes, but evolved from
the same ancestors as apes. Apes have evolved since then as well. Well, I'm an
atheist for such reasons as this, where there are obvious flaws in its
reasoning. They say that god created everything, is that an explanation? If a
man poped out of no where and created everything, does that make anymore sense
than matter poping out of no where? One of the theories on evolution, is that
the first life form on earth was very simple, with pretty much just the capacity
to reproduce, made of a combination of proteins. They have yet to create them in
natural circumstances, but have in laboratories.
Priincess: do you mean Darwin's theory? He had said before he died, that his
theory is completely wrong
-Ah, princess. I'm sorry, but these were not darwin's last words. We had this
discussion before a while back. His last words were "I am not in the least
afraid to die".
Heres a link his biography: http://www.public.coe.edu/departments/Biology/darwin_bio.html
Quote: Priincess, do you know the
purpose of theories? Are you familiar with the simple concept of the scientific
method? You start with a hypothesis. That is essentially an idea that you think
makes sense. Once that idea has some kind of relevance, it becomes theory.
Theories are then studied in great detail and are either proven, thereby
becoming a law, or more often than not disproven
yes i
understand, as i told you what the professor said. theory can be used for our
life. but not all theories are right.
Quote: "heres this book, what
it says goes. There's no proof necessary you just must accept what is in here
and that is all."
you believe in scientist right, me
too. we believe because we know it makes sense. and what i think make sense also
is God and everything i learn from Him. you couldnt think it makes sense
because, you havent met Him. (back to the problem) scientist, historiologist,
anthroplogist..uhm, what else? make bible as their sources. who says there's no
proof? bible is the proof that God's exist. do you think the prophets and the
others were only a fiction character? several days ago there was an inheritance
of boat that Pharaoh used to cross a river. several months ago a man discovered
the inheritances of church. the scholars found that it was used by the
prophets.
Quote: Think of it this way why
are there so many colors of birds?
different species,
different colors. hey, i know the limits of evolution. colors change because of
the wheater, food, and everything else. what you said is all about colors. but
you cant change your brain, cant you. what about the tails and the hair all over
the body? humans are in all over the world, do they have any tails? the
different between all of us only our colors. seriously, you dont think you were
from apes, dont you o. O it's only theory..
Quote: -Ah, princess. I'm sorry,
but these were not darwin's last words. We had this discussion before a while
back. His last words were "I am not in the least afraid to die".
Heres a link his biography: http://www.public.coe.edu/departments/Biology/darwin_bio.html
actually nothing in the world that is really true, for all
of us make faults.
Quote by AaragIf I recalled some people
honored more than one god in the bible as for example
the greeks,japanese,and indians how could anyone explain
that
as for your question, if you still do follow ups on this thread, i'll tell you
that it's not some people in the ancient world, it's everyone. they either go
for polytheism or animal worship. the Jews are the first to embrace
monotheism.
like all polytheisms, people marvel at the greatness of the sky(etc) the stars,
the mountains, etc, and therefore made gods out of them. (on the path of
"animal" worship, those are usually not referred as gods, but rather
as spirits) so theres where zeus, ashura, ra, quetzalcoatl, and such come
from.
in fact, change their set of gods all too often, and their myth explains the
change via "overthrow". zeus overthrow his father kronus, earlier
kronus overthrow his father ophienous(? i think this is the name)
as for japanese, their gods are quite similiar to the gods from china, er lang,
guan ying, and such, until buddhism came about. after that, like the chinese,
they mixed their gods with buddhism. and as for the chinese gods, most of them
are famous heroes and generals in the past so great that the people made them
god.
as for hinduism, i dont remember the details, so if you're curios, wikipedia is
there for you .
ok I will find it out but I have one more question in sum mythologies and like u
say some religions worshipped animal gods how did they come about like for
examplt the egyptians and the Jackel can u explain that Oh what is the scroll to
pass to the otherworld about.
Quote by ttweni won't say evolved from
apes, but i would say we have common ancestors in the family
tree
That is acceptable. Its Ok to have a different opinion, but you can't tell me we
didn't evolve from something. I'm sure we didn't evolve directly from apes, more
like we evolved from cro magnans and neanderthals that had an ape like
relative.
There is undeniable scientific evidence that evolution takes place but there
could be errors with our "family tree."
I believe in God and that evolution has occurred over the many years that
creatures have been on the earth. Not only do we have empirical evidence to
support evolution, but a written history as well (mostly for animals, but I
suppose petroglyphs and
cave drawings count). I don't believe that we humans are direct decendants from
apes, I think there are genetic similarities as well as a break in our family
tree and there's always plenty of room for errors.
Quote by Aaragsum mythologies and like u
say some religions worshipped animal gods how did they come about like for
examplt the egyptians and the Jackel can u explain that Oh what is the scroll to
pass to the otherworld about.
I think those mythologies came about the same way as others did. They saw nature
and wanted to make a reason for why things happened. They also revered cats and
worshipped them. Jackals were worshipped as lords of the dead because they ate
the dead. They are all over The Egyption book of The Dead (I think that's what
you were asking about) and show how they embalmed their deceased. The Book of
the Dead also give instructions to the deseased where to go and what
rituals/what to do in the afterlife.
Animals can become sacred to a people because of those animal's qualities. North
American Indians peoples worshiped the thunderbird - a beast as big as a plane
and is now though to have been some prehistoric bird/pterasaur that survived,
the also respected bears, puma, bobcats, eagles, and many other creatures too...
(other people's from all over the world had the same beliefs about their local
animals). All because of how they respected those animals and they saw the raw
power of nature within those creatures. Each animal had different abilities and
like most humans, we envy what we do not ourselves posesses. I'm sure that's why
many religions have animal/beast like gods and worshipped them.
Are... you... serious? Seriously, do you read your own typing before you hit
"Submit Post"? How the hell can you consider what you just said as
arguments? You, a girl barely capable of forming a proper sentence, has
single-handedly discredit all empirical evidence that science has about the
possibilities of evolution? World-renowned scientists who have spent their
entire careers studying the origins of man, have just been schooled by a 16 year
old girl? I'm actually leaving this computer right now to vomit.
religious historians? i don't think so. assuming that you read all the comment in the thread that you post in, i remembered that one of the MT member did mention as well about this point? and don't forget geological proof have been found for biblical events.
personally, i feel that your points are more of personal opinion than facts. scholars studying religions and geologist have found much proof regarding the events in the Bible, but i admit that to your credit, many are still in the dark.
and aside from that, i curious to know what makes you think the Christian God is arrogance.
The answer to your question is simple: One must question the storied logic of an all-knowing, all-powerful god that creates faulty humans and blames them for their mistakes.
Look at it from this perspective. A mother and father is essentially "the creator" for their children. They raise them and love them. So what if that child reached age 20 and they didn't like how he/she turned out... so they decided to kill him? That is essentially the God you speak of. He creates humans which have faults and then if he doesn't like the way they turned out, casts them into hell. Hmmm.
Not only that, but as I've previously mentioned, if I accomplish something in life it isn't because of me, but of God. HE gave me the strength. HE gave me the wisdom. HE made it happen. If I don't praise and worship him for the things HE did, I'm doomed for hell. Hmmm.
I can give to charity, serve my country and be a wonderful husband and father, but because I didn't believe in him, I'm doomed for hell. I can live the life of a saint but with the purpose of helping humans because I am a human, but not worship him, I'm doomed to hell. Hmmm.
Notice a patern? That is arrogance.
i see that your concept of going to hell is all messed up? i'll guess that its because your parents drill the "how to go to hell" thing into your head?
but my concept of going to hell is different from what you thought. for me, you go to hell is when you don't believe in God or stop believing him, or even believe theres God but don't accept him. sure, humans are indeed very faulty, but even if you believe in God and accepts him even in the last second in your life, you still get your ticket to heaven.
trust me, believing in God and accepting him a few moments later is a very hard thing to do, because you cannot lie to yourself. and, what about the sins? i believe sins are unavoidable but as a Christian it is our obligation to obey the 10 commandments, theres no whatsoever punishment for breaking it, but still we have to obey the best we can the 10 commandments. as for charities and voluntarisms, they are also on free will basis, even though they are on God's orders. that is why being a Christian needs a lot of discipline and that is why many people leave Christianity. and that is why i won't force my beliefs onto anyone, because you may be a Christian in name, but deep inside you are still not.
from my eyes, accomplishments and wisdoms are from God, as do failures. I see everyone has their own purposes set by God, even little things; for example, this might be God's will for me to tell you all these. and in fact this may be his will for you to tell me why you deny Him.
Well, this is what I believe of God, as I have many years ago. I grew up in a Christian family, but my parents don't force their beliefs onto me. I accept God and believed in Him on my own accord. and in this sense, i don't see him as arrogant.
anyway, since you told me what you think of God, i told you what i think of him also
what researches, for the first who tought bout that theory said himself that he's wrong. and if we evolved from apes, how can apes are still here in this world? i dont think that any animals could evolve into completely different form, like their tails and brains, we're lot smarter than them. and yeah, i know that horses long time ago were as short as cat's size. have you found something like that now? cats and tigers or a husky and a wolf look similar, but they are not the same. oh, maybe you should think that some humans in the past turned into apes. you know what scientists do? they're making theories, and they want their theories can be used in life. that's what their job is. said a profesor from a university of america
Please someone launch a gun and shoot me...
Please, unbelievable
Shoujoboy made some good points and you two failed 2 see it.
Priincess, do you know the purpose of theories? Are you familiar with the simple concept of the scientific method? You start with a hypothesis. That is essentially an idea that you think makes sense. Once that idea has some kind of relevance, it becomes theory. Theories are then studied in great detail and are either proven, thereby becoming a law, or more often than not disproven.
Yes, evolution is a theory. The Big Bang is a theory. But instead of "I have a good idea, this is the absolute truth", science aims to prove/disprove those said theories. Religion on the other hand says "heres this book, what it says goes. There's no proof necessary you just must accept what is in here and that is all." There are millions of possibilites as to the origins of man. We could be a science experiment for some other civilization. We could be the result of a fart from a magical being millions of years ago. We may be decended from rocks. Who knows? You don't, I don't, nobody does.
But these are questions that can't simply be answered with a book written millenia ago. These are questions that must be investigated.
Priincess, stop appealing to authority. You did it twice in that last post.
Apes are in this world because according to evolution animals evolve to have the characteristics best suited to their environment. Apes can live in jungles and most people couldn't survive. On the other hand apes cannot live in deserts whereas people have learned how to survive in them. Think of it this way why are there so many colors of birds? In wooded areas its more beneficial for birds that can blend in better so they can avoid being eaten. In arctic regions it favors birds that are white so they blend with the snow. Even people vary greatly depending on the environment they live in. Africans have dark skin so that they don't burn in the harsh sun. Natives in south america are short and have barrel chests so they can survive in high altitudes. I could go on and on about this.
Btw seriously get MS word or something. It's hard to take you seriously with such glaring errors.
^actually, white skins fare better under the sun; black absorbs, white reflects. thats why "white" skin don't sweat as much as "black" skin under a hot sun.
anyway, this discussion is just going around in circles.
Except that white skin burns under the sun while black skin is less effected. Not only that, but sweating is a good thing in hot environments. Sweat cools your body as it evaporates, so by your logic that would also give the advantage to black skin.
well yes, you got a point there too
as for your question, if you still do follow ups on this thread, i'll tell you that it's not some people in the ancient world, it's everyone. they either go for polytheism or animal worship. the Jews are the first to embrace monotheism.
like all polytheisms, people marvel at the greatness of the sky(etc) the stars, the mountains, etc, and therefore made gods out of them. (on the path of "animal" worship, those are usually not referred as gods, but rather as spirits) so theres where zeus, ashura, ra, quetzalcoatl, and such come from.
in fact, change their set of gods all too often, and their myth explains the change via "overthrow". zeus overthrow his father kronus, earlier kronus overthrow his father ophienous(? i think this is the name)
as for japanese, their gods are quite similiar to the gods from china, er lang, guan ying, and such, until buddhism came about. after that, like the chinese, they mixed their gods with buddhism. and as for the chinese gods, most of them are famous heroes and generals in the past so great that the people made them god.
as for hinduism, i dont remember the details, so if you're curios, wikipedia is there for you
.
-We'll technically science doesnt predict we evolved from apes, but evolved from the same ancestors as apes. Apes have evolved since then as well. Well, I'm an atheist for such reasons as this, where there are obvious flaws in its reasoning. They say that god created everything, is that an explanation? If a man poped out of no where and created everything, does that make anymore sense than matter poping out of no where? One of the theories on evolution, is that the first life form on earth was very simple, with pretty much just the capacity to reproduce, made of a combination of proteins. They have yet to create them in natural circumstances, but have in laboratories.
Priincess: do you mean Darwin's theory? He had said before he died, that his theory is completely wrong
-Ah, princess. I'm sorry, but these were not darwin's last words. We had this discussion before a while back. His last words were "I am not in the least afraid to die".
Heres a link his biography: http://www.public.coe.edu/departments/Biology/darwin_bio.html
yes i understand, as i told you what the professor said. theory can be used for our life. but not all theories are right.
you believe in scientist right, me too. we believe because we know it makes sense. and what i think make sense also is God and everything i learn from Him. you couldnt think it makes sense because, you havent met Him. (back to the problem) scientist, historiologist, anthroplogist..uhm, what else? make bible as their sources. who says there's no proof? bible is the proof that God's exist. do you think the prophets and the others were only a fiction character? several days ago there was an inheritance of boat that Pharaoh used to cross a river. several months ago a man discovered the inheritances of church. the scholars found that it was used by the prophets.
different species, different colors. hey, i know the limits of evolution. colors change because of the wheater, food, and everything else. what you said is all about colors. but you cant change your brain, cant you. what about the tails and the hair all over the body? humans are in all over the world, do they have any tails? the different between all of us only our colors. seriously, you dont think you were from apes, dont you o. O it's only theory..
actually nothing in the world that is really true, for all of us make faults.
Priinces humans don't have tails but we do have what used to be a tail bone. Evidence we evolved from apes.
i won't say evolved from apes, but i would say we have common ancestors in the family tree
ok I will find it out but I have one more question in sum mythologies and like u say some religions worshipped animal gods how did they come about like for examplt the egyptians and the Jackel can u explain that Oh what is the scroll to pass to the otherworld about.
That is acceptable. Its Ok to have a different opinion, but you can't tell me we didn't evolve from something. I'm sure we didn't evolve directly from apes, more like we evolved from cro magnans and neanderthals that had an ape like relative.
There is undeniable scientific evidence that evolution takes place but there could be errors with our "family tree."
I believe in God and that evolution has occurred over the many years that creatures have been on the earth. Not only do we have empirical evidence to support evolution, but a written history as well (mostly for animals, but I suppose petroglyphs and cave drawings count). I don't believe that we humans are direct decendants from apes, I think there are genetic similarities as well as a break in our family tree and there's always plenty of room for errors.
I think those mythologies came about the same way as others did. They saw nature and wanted to make a reason for why things happened. They also revered cats and worshipped them. Jackals were worshipped as lords of the dead because they ate the dead. They are all over The Egyption book of The Dead (I think that's what you were asking about) and show how they embalmed their deceased. The Book of the Dead also give instructions to the deseased where to go and what rituals/what to do in the afterlife.
Animals can become sacred to a people because of those animal's qualities. North American Indians peoples worshiped the thunderbird - a beast as big as a plane and is now though to have been some prehistoric bird/pterasaur that survived, the also respected bears, puma, bobcats, eagles, and many other creatures too... (other people's from all over the world had the same beliefs about their local animals). All because of how they respected those animals and they saw the raw power of nature within those creatures. Each animal had different abilities and like most humans, we envy what we do not ourselves posesses. I'm sure that's why many religions have animal/beast like gods and worshipped them.
that was exactly what I was talking about
or maybe bears. or tigers. no, the tail bone of ours is just short from the 1st, n no change. humans and animals are different.
If humans are so different how come doctors can put pig heart valves into people?
a scientist? you know they make theories to be used in our lifes. i know 100% we're not an evolution from anything.
if you say so, you mean you are also the same as pig or dog
Are... you... serious? Seriously, do you read your own typing before you hit "Submit Post"? How the hell can you consider what you just said as arguments? You, a girl barely capable of forming a proper sentence, has single-handedly discredit all empirical evidence that science has about the possibilities of evolution? World-renowned scientists who have spent their entire careers studying the origins of man, have just been schooled by a 16 year old girl? I'm actually leaving this computer right now to vomit.