Well, this is about what is happening on our country for the last few days.
Politics is becoming a very big issue and even the Church now got involved.
As a result... Politics VS Religion!
Guys, what do you think about this matter. Is it going to be good since the
Church got involved on political problems or it'll just make it
worse?
Well... None of them can be trusted!
No one can avoid the chance of having corruption within politics and the church
is too over-zealous about a crappy God or something! All-in-all the best
solution to your problem is to make me the President of your country.
I promise to:
- Destroy all terrorist by raiding them of their homes and families w/o any
concern about their hostages(if ever)! Who cares? Their not related to me
anyway.
- Shoot the heads of any corrupt or opposing officials within the government.
Why not? Their corrupt... Better dispose of them earlier before they do
something stupid.
- Those who oppose me will die!! Yeah you heared it!
- Finish of group movements such as coup-de-tas, rallies, etc... by bombing them
during their attempt to overthrow MY goverment and then later, blame the cause
of the bombing to anonimous terrorist groups. A great strategist always has ways
to cover their tracks in times of distress.
- Totally annihilate useless beliefs, norms, codes, etc... from the society so
as to prevent under development due to certain cultural boundaries. Duh!?
Beleifs are stupid! Like praying or something can give you what you want. So I
say remove them to have an open-minded view of reality. There will definitely be
no GOD to save you!
- Educate the willing and able, leave the others behind... ONLY THE strong WILL
survive!!
- Take over the rest of the world... Nyahahahahaha! Yeah! You heard it!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Anyways this are just suggestions of what I would do...
I can't see how Religion can make political problems worse.
I would say religion can make things better because without religion their would
be no morals.
A system of just politics without religion will go to ruin because each person
involved is thinking of how to reach a better standing with more power.
Religion teaches morals and that looking out for yourself is destructive.
Sorry if this sounds like politics are evil or people without religion have no
morals,
I am just stating what I think. You can take it all as a grain of sand.
Quote by KoenkenI can't see how Religion
can make political problems worse.
I would say religion can make things better because without religion
their would be no morals.
A system of just politics without religion will go to ruin because each
person involved is thinking of how to reach a better standing with more
power. Religion teaches morals and that looking out for yourself is
destructive.
Sorry if this sounds like politics are evil or people without religion
have no morals, I am just stating what I think. You can take it all as
a grain of sand.
Actually they can... by having the Church interrupt the government they can
actually alter the decision-making of the government. The Church gives an ideal
view of the world where everything is perfect! And an ideal world is definitely
impossible. By doing so they limit the access of options of the government by
giving them a close-minded view of solutions to solve the problems of the
government. Take this for example:
The Church states: Though shall not kill!
This is your condition:
You are about to be killed by a certain someone.
He then dropped his knife.
You managed to pick it up before he did.
You get a flashback! *whoa* Priest says: (Though shall not kill my child)
You think... should I kill him?
... Well if I was in this situation I would say fuck the rules God! It's either
him or me!
The Questions:
- Who would be stupid enough to accept the terms of the Church when you are in
this situation?
- What will you choose? Your life or your belief?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
By taking into account this situation and linking it to the government wouldn't
the Churches ideals be a hindrence to the government...
Religion is a large part of politics. The Church represents a large and
significant part of the poeple and it influences their political standing, which
in effect, influences political policies. I don't see how the Church can really
make anything worse; if anything, the Church will only hinder several
"advancements" (this depending on which side you're on)...
Anyway, I often find that the bigger issues is the politics of Religion versus
Science...
Quote by zephrynif anything, the
Church
will only hinder several "advancements" (this depending on which
side
you're on)...
Like the legalization of divorce, population
control through contraceptives and acknowledgment of gay marriages.
No, I don't think that it's Politics vs. Church but rather, State vs. Church. I,
for one, am for the State. The Constitution is easier to interpret than the
Bible and it doesn't have as much loopholes. Also, Church decrees depend on the
very fickle, and sometimes self-contradictory, minds of the Institution.
Remember that it was only a few months ago that the CBCP openly condemned
jueteng. When that issue about parishes getting "donations" from
jueteng came out, the Conference suddenly became tight-lipped. They can at least
be consistent, yeah?
Religion ad politics... You see, religion and politics both aim or at least must
aim to eradicate the evils of the country they serve... Now, If the church or if
politics just hamper the progress of the other, something's wrong! I think the
problem lies from the fact that some politicians think the church is abolishing
"imaginary" devils of morality, and some church personalities think
politicians are spending their time wrong chasing after some evil political
stuff...
Politics and the Church must go together to solve the problems of the country
they both serve... Just thinking out loud... Hai! Over and Out!
Actually, religion is a really important part of politics. Look at any western
country for example. Their politics are all based on the old Catholic Church.
All our laws are derived from it. Since church is a large part in people's life,
it automatically become a large part in politics.
The reason why churchs go involve themselves in politics is so that they can
defend their moral believes from the new changes, ie abortion and gay marriage.
I think the church should intervine in politics since they stand for the point
of view for many people. In a democracy society, it is important to hear
everyone's opinion and many of those opinions are often ignored. Therefore, the
church is a great way for people to voice their opinion in politics.
Remember that there are no things such as evil & holy, good & bad, right
& wrong!
Different opinions just clash from time to time thus creating diferrences in
beliefs...
So its matter of fact that both parties maybe biased upon each individual's
belief!
I, for one, don't believe in anything or anyone... I wont depend on others for
my survival... though you may say "how about the guidance of your
parents?", well... that's a different story. And I promise to pay them back
for their support!
If you want to live life... then learn to adopt, change always happens, and even
if you feel that these changes are not to your liking... Suppress those desires
and be mature!
somehow, religion can lead the politics else where.
it depends on the situation actually.. but i dont really know wether its gonna
be worse or better lol..
Religion is worse because it can't be argued with. If the faith says it's right,
it *is*, in politics you can at least use reason to maybe convince the other
party.
Well, you can say that religion is political but only on "some"
aspects.
Quote by pyromaniac-kittyIt's a
business plot....what can you expect?!
That I must agree!
Quote by Koenken
I can't see how Religion can make political problems worse.
I would say religion can make things better because without religion their would
be no morals.
A system of just politics without religion will go to ruin because each person
involved is thinking of how to reach a better standing with more power.
Religion teaches morals and that looking out for yourself is destructive.
Sorry if this sounds like politics are evil or people without religion have no
morals,
I am just stating what I think. You can take it all as a grain of sand.
It's okay Koenken. It's just opinions anyway. But on your first parts, you may
say that it can make politics better but you never know what powerful people
think. They can just trash God for some power and money.
Quote by zephryn
Religion is a large part of politics. The Church represents a large and
significant part of the poeple and it influences their political standing, which
in effect, influences political policies. I don't see how the Church can really
make anything worse; if anything, the Church will only hinder several
"advancements" (this depending on which side you're on)...
I also agree with you on how religion can influence politics and on the hinder
part, well, it's only natural since sometimes religion have some different ideas
on what politics thinks.
Quote by zephryn
Anyway, I often find that the bigger issues is the politics of Religion versus
Science...
That is the battle for the truth I must say.
Quote by RainOfStarsActually,
religion is a really important part of politics. Look at any western country for
example. Their politics are all based on the old Catholic Church. All our laws
are derived from it. Since church is a large part in people's life, it
automatically become a large part in politics.
The reason why churchs go involve themselves in politics is so that they can
defend their moral believes from the new changes, ie abortion and gay marriage.
I think the church should intervine in politics since they stand for the point
of view for many people. In a democracy society, it is important to hear
everyone's opinion and many of those opinions are often ignored. Therefore, the
church is a great way for people to voice their opinion in
politics.
It kinda reminds me of the Ranaissance Era. You know... how the church kinda got
invovled into politics and all that. But hmm... I'm not sure what's going in
your country, Akai. For some reason, if church is going to be involved as
peacemaker, that's not really a problem at all though. But if you're saying
church involved into something big and troublesome...
But yeah, Religion versus Science happened. You know Galileo Galilei's murder is
because the Church didn't believe his theory of Sun is the center of the galaxy?
The Church kinda denied that and said that Earth is the center. And for trying
to challenge the Church's knowledge, he was sentenced to death by drinking..
poison? If I'm not wrong, it was stated in my history textbook. Cruel... hehhe,
but that was last time.
Well, nothing wrong with religion anticipating in politics. I mean, if they're
doing a good thing, why not? Maybe... I'm not sure what will they do in that
side though. Trying to get people back to the right track through political
campaigne? Dunno that one either. But as long as they're there as a universal
peacemaker, nothing wrong with that. ^^ Anyways, that's a good question.
I think that there's nothing wrong if religion will be concerned with the
decisions in politics. As long as there will be nothing wrong.
As what Ephemeral-Garden said:
Quote by Ephemeral-GardenBut
yeah, Religion versus Science happened. You know Galileo Galilei's murder is
because the Church didn't believe his theory of Sun is the center of the galaxy?
The Church kinda denied that and said that Earth is the center. And for trying
to challenge the Church's knowledge, he was sentenced to death by drinking..
poison? If I'm not wrong, it was stated in my history textbook. Cruel... hehhe,
but that was last time.
If this thing will happen to politics... that's really bad. Killing a person
that's a genius? If he lived longer, then he might have discovered more things.
What if this will happen to politics? Not implementing a policy? That will give
benefits to people just because it is against in some beliefs of the
religion?
For example, the two-child policy and artificial birth control. The religion
opposed with these rules... but I think that these policies will help our
country since Philippines is over populated today... I think that these policies
will give benefits to our people. I think that we must try these policies and if
these policies will not work then we should think of a better policy in
controlling the population of our country. Well, these are just my
opinions...
Quote by zephrynAnyway, I often find that
the bigger issues is the politics of Religion versus Science...
Quote by AkaikenWell, this is about what
is happening on our country for the last few
days.
what country is that?....philippenes?
either way politics and religion have an undestroyable link in todays society
which unfortunately in some cases is not a very good thing(AIDS spread as pope
says, no contraceptives..blah blah blah). i wouldnt say it makes it worse as
politics changes to suit societys needs(democratically speaking). well i didn't
really answer the question but nevermind...
First of all, I must make it clear that I am a firm believer in the separation
of church and state. I believe that I must, however, also make it clear that
separation of church and state does not mean exclusion of church in state. Rather, I interpret such a
doctrine as not conferring any privileged position or imposing any penalty upon
religion vis-a-vis other influences in the mechanisms of governance.
In this discussion on whether religion should play a role in politics, one must
remember that in most governing systems, religion played a key role in the
formation of government and the construction of organic statutes. Therefore, in
a way, religion is inseparable as it lent much of the fundamental assumptions of
morality and conduct that influenced the creation of policies and legislation.
As to whether the church as an institution should have a say, remember that most
of us live in representative democracies where the ideologies of the
constituents are the prime determinant of policy formation. In that case,
churches may be courted by individual political parties as a means of gaining
favor in individual constituencies, and therefore have some greater influence on
policies. Furthermore, the existing organizational structure of churches make
them uniquely suited to perform certain tasks, typically humanitarian in nature,
in assistance to a central government.
Therefore, I believe that churches should be recognized as players in public
policy just as corporations, organizations, political parties, and other groups
are players. It seriously bewilders me that so many of you simply write off
politics and religion as being forces of evil while ignoring the critical effect
that they have in life. Political maneuvering is an essential requirement of
policymaking in governing systems, and religion plays not only a key role in the
ideologies of most of the world's population, but also serves as the progenitor
of most conceptions of morality, ethics, culture, and tradition.
This is not an easy question to consider, and coming up with a proper answer
isn't something that can be done by oversimplification and painting the issue
with both too broad a brush and too narrow a palette of colors.
Quote by shinsengumiFirst of all, I
must make it clear that I am a firm believer in the
separation of church and state. I believe that I must, however, also
make it clear that separation of church and state does not mean exclusion of church in state. Rather, I
interpret such a
doctrine as not conferring any privileged position or imposing any
penalty upon religion vis-a-vis other influences in the mechanisms of
governance.
In this discussion on whether religion should play a role in politics,
one must remember that in most governing systems, religion played a key
role in the formation of government and the construction of organic
statutes. Therefore, in a way, religion is inseparable as it lent much
of the fundamental assumptions of morality and conduct that influenced
the creation of policies and legislation. As to whether the church as
an institution should have a say, remember that most of us live in
representative democracies where the ideologies of the constituents are
the prime determinant of policy formation. In that case, churches may
be courted by individual political parties as a means of gaining favor
in individual constituencies, and therefore have some greater influence
on policies. Furthermore, the existing organizational structure of
churches make them uniquely suited to perform certain tasks, typically
humanitarian in nature, in assistance to a central government.
Therefore, I believe that churches should be recognized as players in
public policy just as corporations, organizations, political parties,
and other groups are players. It seriously bewilders me that so many of
you simply write off politics and religion as being forces of evil
while ignoring the critical effect that they have in life. Political
maneuvering is an essential requirement of policymaking in governing
systems, and religion plays not only a key role in the ideologies of
most of the world's population, but also serves as the progenitor of
most conceptions of morality, ethics, culture, and tradition.
This is not an easy question to consider, and coming up with a proper
answer isn't something that can be done by oversimplification and
painting the issue with both too broad a brush and too narrow a palette
of colors.
I was writing something very similar, but then I
saw your statement and
you basically pointed out what I was going to say. Good job.
Damn, been a while since I last made a thread...
Well, this is about what is happening on our country for the last few days. Politics is becoming a very big issue and even the Church now got involved.
As a result... Politics VS Religion!
Guys, what do you think about this matter. Is it going to be good since the Church got involved on political problems or it'll just make it worse?
Religion is politicall.
It's a business plot....what can you expect?!
Well... None of them can be trusted!
No one can avoid the chance of having corruption within politics and the church is too over-zealous about a crappy God or something! All-in-all the best solution to your problem is to make me the President of your country.
I promise to:
- Destroy all terrorist by raiding them of their homes and families w/o any concern about their hostages(if ever)! Who cares? Their not related to me anyway.
- Shoot the heads of any corrupt or opposing officials within the government. Why not? Their corrupt... Better dispose of them earlier before they do something stupid.
- Those who oppose me will die!! Yeah you heared it!
- Finish of group movements such as coup-de-tas, rallies, etc... by bombing them during their attempt to overthrow MY goverment and then later, blame the cause of the bombing to anonimous terrorist groups. A great strategist always has ways to cover their tracks in times of distress.
- Totally annihilate useless beliefs, norms, codes, etc... from the society so as to prevent under development due to certain cultural boundaries. Duh!? Beleifs are stupid! Like praying or something can give you what you want. So I say remove them to have an open-minded view of reality. There will definitely be no GOD to save you!
- Educate the willing and able, leave the others behind... ONLY THE strong WILL survive!!
- Take over the rest of the world... Nyahahahahaha! Yeah! You heard it!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Anyways this are just suggestions of what I would do...
I can't see how Religion can make political problems worse.
I would say religion can make things better because without religion their would be no morals.
A system of just politics without religion will go to ruin because each person involved is thinking of how to reach a better standing with more power.
Religion teaches morals and that looking out for yourself is destructive.
Sorry if this sounds like politics are evil or people without religion have no morals,
I am just stating what I think. You can take it all as a grain of sand.
both are wackalak
Actually they can... by having the Church interrupt the government they can actually alter the decision-making of the government. The Church gives an ideal view of the world where everything is perfect! And an ideal world is definitely impossible. By doing so they limit the access of options of the government by giving them a close-minded view of solutions to solve the problems of the government. Take this for example:
The Church states: Though shall not kill!
This is your condition:
You are about to be killed by a certain someone.
He then dropped his knife.
You managed to pick it up before he did.
You get a flashback! *whoa* Priest says: (Though shall not kill my child)
You think... should I kill him?
... Well if I was in this situation I would say fuck the rules God! It's either him or me!
The Questions:
- Who would be stupid enough to accept the terms of the Church when you are in this situation?
- What will you choose? Your life or your belief?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
By taking into account this situation and linking it to the government wouldn't the Churches ideals be a hindrence to the government...
Religion is a large part of politics. The Church represents a large and significant part of the poeple and it influences their political standing, which in effect, influences political policies. I don't see how the Church can really make anything worse; if anything, the Church will only hinder several "advancements" (this depending on which side you're on)...
Anyway, I often find that the bigger issues is the politics of Religion versus Science...
Like the legalization of divorce, population control through contraceptives and acknowledgment of gay marriages.
No, I don't think that it's Politics vs. Church but rather, State vs. Church. I, for one, am for the State. The Constitution is easier to interpret than the Bible and it doesn't have as much loopholes. Also, Church decrees depend on the very fickle, and sometimes self-contradictory, minds of the Institution. Remember that it was only a few months ago that the CBCP openly condemned jueteng. When that issue about parishes getting "donations" from jueteng came out, the Conference suddenly became tight-lipped. They can at least be consistent, yeah?
Religion ad politics... You see, religion and politics both aim or at least must aim to eradicate the evils of the country they serve... Now, If the church or if politics just hamper the progress of the other, something's wrong! I think the problem lies from the fact that some politicians think the church is abolishing "imaginary" devils of morality, and some church personalities think politicians are spending their time wrong chasing after some evil political stuff...
Politics and the Church must go together to solve the problems of the country they both serve... Just thinking out loud... Hai! Over and Out!
Actually, religion is a really important part of politics. Look at any western country for example. Their politics are all based on the old Catholic Church. All our laws are derived from it. Since church is a large part in people's life, it automatically become a large part in politics.
The reason why churchs go involve themselves in politics is so that they can defend their moral believes from the new changes, ie abortion and gay marriage. I think the church should intervine in politics since they stand for the point of view for many people. In a democracy society, it is important to hear everyone's opinion and many of those opinions are often ignored. Therefore, the church is a great way for people to voice their opinion in politics.
Remember that there are no things such as evil & holy, good & bad, right & wrong!
Different opinions just clash from time to time thus creating diferrences in beliefs...
So its matter of fact that both parties maybe biased upon each individual's belief!
I, for one, don't believe in anything or anyone... I wont depend on others for my survival... though you may say "how about the guidance of your parents?", well... that's a different story. And I promise to pay them back for their support!
If you want to live life... then learn to adopt, change always happens, and even if you feel that these changes are not to your liking... Suppress those desires and be mature!
somehow, religion can lead the politics else where.
it depends on the situation actually.. but i dont really know wether its gonna be worse or better lol..
Religion is worse because it can't be argued with. If the faith says it's right, it *is*, in politics you can at least use reason to maybe convince the other party.
Well, you can say that religion is political but only on "some" aspects.
That I must agree!
It's okay Koenken. It's just opinions anyway. But on your first parts, you may say that it can make politics better but you never know what powerful people think. They can just trash God for some power and money.
I also agree with you on how religion can influence politics and on the hinder part, well, it's only natural since sometimes religion have some different ideas on what politics thinks.
That is the battle for the truth I must say.
Very well said.
It kinda reminds me of the Ranaissance Era. You know... how the church kinda got invovled into politics and all that. But hmm... I'm not sure what's going in your country, Akai. For some reason, if church is going to be involved as peacemaker, that's not really a problem at all though. But if you're saying church involved into something big and troublesome...
But yeah, Religion versus Science happened. You know Galileo Galilei's murder is because the Church didn't believe his theory of Sun is the center of the galaxy? The Church kinda denied that and said that Earth is the center. And for trying to challenge the Church's knowledge, he was sentenced to death by drinking.. poison? If I'm not wrong, it was stated in my history textbook. Cruel... hehhe, but that was last time.
Well, nothing wrong with religion anticipating in politics. I mean, if they're doing a good thing, why not? Maybe... I'm not sure what will they do in that side though. Trying to get people back to the right track through political campaigne? Dunno that one either. But as long as they're there as a universal peacemaker, nothing wrong with that. ^^ Anyways, that's a good question.
Took the words right out of my mouth.
Religion and Politics run hand in hand. They both run the world and they both are super evil.
For me the religion and the politic are dangerous and both together is very bad.
They're both one big lie!
I think that there's nothing wrong if religion will be concerned with the decisions in politics. As long as there will be nothing wrong.
As what Ephemeral-Garden said:
If this thing will happen to politics... that's really bad. Killing a person that's a genius? If he lived longer, then he might have discovered more things.
For example, the two-child policy and artificial birth control. The religion opposed with these rules... but I think that these policies will help our country since Philippines is over populated today... I think that these policies will give benefits to our people. I think that we must try these policies and if these policies will not work then we should think of a better policy in controlling the population of our country. Well, these are just my opinions...
I really agree.
what country is that?....philippenes?
either way politics and religion have an undestroyable link in todays society which unfortunately in some cases is not a very good thing(AIDS spread as pope says, no contraceptives..blah blah blah). i wouldnt say it makes it worse as politics changes to suit societys needs(democratically speaking). well i didn't really answer the question but nevermind...
First of all, I must make it clear that I am a firm believer in the separation of church and state. I believe that I must, however, also make it clear that separation of church and state does not mean exclusion of church in state. Rather, I interpret such a doctrine as not conferring any privileged position or imposing any penalty upon religion vis-a-vis other influences in the mechanisms of governance.
In this discussion on whether religion should play a role in politics, one must remember that in most governing systems, religion played a key role in the formation of government and the construction of organic statutes. Therefore, in a way, religion is inseparable as it lent much of the fundamental assumptions of morality and conduct that influenced the creation of policies and legislation.
As to whether the church as an institution should have a say, remember that most of us live in representative democracies where the ideologies of the constituents are the prime determinant of policy formation. In that case, churches may be courted by individual political parties as a means of gaining favor in individual constituencies, and therefore have some greater influence on policies. Furthermore, the existing organizational structure of churches make them uniquely suited to perform certain tasks, typically humanitarian in nature, in assistance to a central government.
Therefore, I believe that churches should be recognized as players in public policy just as corporations, organizations, political parties, and other groups are players. It seriously bewilders me that so many of you simply write off politics and religion as being forces of evil while ignoring the critical effect that they have in life. Political maneuvering is an essential requirement of policymaking in governing systems, and religion plays not only a key role in the ideologies of most of the world's population, but also serves as the progenitor of most conceptions of morality, ethics, culture, and tradition.
This is not an easy question to consider, and coming up with a proper answer isn't something that can be done by oversimplification and painting the issue with both too broad a brush and too narrow a palette of colors.
^ Thats a good answer
I was writing something very similar, but then I saw your statement and
you basically pointed out what I was going to say. Good job.