REPORT: More Rips - minitokyo.net

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Jim3535

Jim3535

Shinigami

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I ran across the worst ripping site yet. It has thousands of ripped artworks, many of which are incorporated into wallpapers. Despite the fact that they are blatant rips, the people are claiming the works to be their own. We should really contact biri and get her to talk to the admin of the site. All of the stolen work must be deleted as soon as possible. Let's all join their forums and bash them.

http://www.minitokyo.net/

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Disclaimer:

Please excuse the satire above, it was necessary to get your attention. No doubt I'm going to step on a few toes with what follows, however, I believe that it is necessary to create serious discussion and get people to think outside the box. I've sat in the shadows too long out of fear of being banned for speaking outside the MT paradigm. Let it be clear that I do not endorse ripping or other unauthorized copying of wallpapers; my comments here are mainly about how MT users (should) react to it.

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MT needs a clear and consistent policy when it comes to copyrighted works. The policy states: "It is forbidden to submit any material that is unlawful, false, misleading, harmful, insulting, threatening, abusive, invasive, harassing, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, pornographic, hateful, racially or otherwise objectionable, including without limitation material of any kind or nature that encourages conduct that could constitute a criminal offense, give rise to civil liability or otherwise violate any applicable local, state, provincial, national, or international law or regulation." As stated later in the policy: "...scans, in which in most cases the member did not have permission to redistribute the material". This is clearly copyright infringement and violates official MT policy.

One might try to make the fansub argument and claim that they don't mind MT distributing the copyrighted material because it gives them advertising. I must admit that I know nothing of them either supporting or condemning these acts. However, I find it very hard to believe that they would condone distributing high quality scans of art books, pencil boards, posters, magazine images, etc. which are designed to generate revenue.

And if an inconsistent policy isn't bad enough, everybody condemns the very behavior they participate in. Distributing these illegal scans of artbooks and other materials is no different from distributing wallpapers without permission. In both cases copyright infringement is taking place even if no one claims to own the works. However, one might make the argument that wallpaper creators are even worse because they usually claim ownership of the wallpapers even though they contain illegal artwork. Two wrongs don't make a right, and that's doubly wrong. Deviantart realized this and hence doesn't allow anime wallpapers unless you have drawn the entire thing yourself. However, let's be realistic here. MT would die a quick death if it really held up to the high moral standards that people think it does. All the scans and wallpapers made from them would have go. Given that doesn't sound like a feasible option, I would suggest amending the policy to be more realistic and consistent with itself.

The line has to be drawn somewhere; even Nuriko said "Question to biri: If we're going to be submitting ripped wall links to user-uploaded pages, what about places like Hongfire? Do we draw the line someplace?"

I think that the term ripping has become far too broad and over used. It is used to describe both very benign redistribution of work and outright punks who remove signatures and claim the work as their own. Any time the work ‘rip' is used, it's a signal for the lynch mob on MT to pounce and destroy anything in its way.

Rip - Unauthorized altering of a work or otherwise claiming ownership of it. This includes removing / covering signatures, using parts of the work as an avatar / signature or another work such as a wallpaper. It does not cover resizing the original work.

Distro - Distribution of unaltered works, except resizing, without claiming credit for the work(s). Examples posting wallpapers to image boards, forum galleries, irc packages, torrents, or other non-art communities for which this is within their policy. Distros are trademarked by their lack of malicious intent towards the artists and the service they provide to fans.

I would suggest drawing the line between rips and distros. The only reason I have come to know that MT is so anti-leecher is purely bandwith limitations. Even the first line in the policy states that "Minitokyo strives to be a free, open community". The way I see it is that MT is a victim of its own popularity and restrictions have built up to keep the riff-raff out and out of pure necessity. If MT doesn't want to serve the lecchers who don't want to contribute, let someone else serve that role. Almost every wall is made with ripped images anyway, so I fail to see how it can be that devastating to have your wall on a more open site so long as no one takes credit for it.

The complaints in ripping threads are extremely out of control. People resort to flaming, bashing, threatening personal injury, making allusions to preparing weapons to smite them with, etc. Yes I'm looking at you eunasahng, exentric, Criox, Vinitachi, GintheTwilightswords, Aa-chan, breadcrust, streamside, Anjeile, Teryon, Odysseus, white-zero, satan123, stellar, kuroimisa, diamarrr, wuschel, and many others. It's not just contained to the threads either people are advocating going to the offending websites and bashing / flaming the users / admins there. Have you no dignity and self control? You look like a bunch of winy little brats trying to form a lynch mob. Not to mention posting comments like "man, can't anyone do something about this" do absolutely nothing to help, but rather just add clutter and take up space. Why not listen to Biri and act with a bit of dignity?

People go absolutely crazy when wallpapers are posted on other sites intact and with no credit claimed. The entire purpose of a signature on the wallpaper is to let people know who the creator is and hopefully provide a link to the originating website. People claim that this is extremely bad since no one visits the creator's website. However, I claim the opposite is true. I can not even begin to list all the websites that I have discovered through signatures on wallpapers. Especially when I was not familiar with the wallpaper creating community the easiest way to quality work is to see a nice wallpaper on a mass distribution site and then visit the creator's website.

The purpose of a signature is to indicate who created the wallpaper and provide a link their website. However, it seems that some people have decided to write editorials about the evils of ripping and make personal threats in them. Signatures should blend into the wall and not stick out like a sore thumb. Many of us use non-standard desktop layouts or multiple screens that do not hide the signatures. It's very sad when someone makes a really nice wall that I can't use simply because of their huge, ugly "DIE RIPPERZ!!!1" signature.

What should be done:
The best way to fight any problem is to go for the source. The primary motivation to upload wallpapers to these distro sites is because MT is so locked down. I propose creating an AD supported mirror of MT that is for unregistered users. It would contain the wallpapers and possibly greatly reduced quality scans that are free for any visitor to get. It isn't hard to have a website that is completely ad supported, especially if more annoying and higher paying ads are displayed. This would have absolutely no effect on normal members who have registered.

This system would give the leechers all they want and leave no reason for anyone to go to other sites for walls. MT is perhaps the largest wallpaper archive on the net with the most quality submissions. It seems uniquely poised to dominate the anime wallpaper scene. All that is needed is to serve the leecher segment. I believe this would greatly reduce the frequency of walls posted to other websites and would generally make everyone happy. However, this suggestion will get ignored because they always do.

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crewcifix

crewcifix

Christian Boy

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oh my goodness! :(

Feel the Rain on Your Skin. No One Else can Feel it For You. Only You Can Let it in.
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-=Admin&Mod=- Flip | Ice and Snow | Nippon Foods | TSubasa | Pure Light Love | Assistance Coalescence | Make a Friend | FMWS | Syaoran shrine | Filipino Comm. | Sakura | Sea | Pokemon League | SS shrine | The Real Folk Blues | English | McDonald's

  • Jun 02, 2005

KorganoS

KorganoS

Busy atm ^_^;;

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LoL... indeed your introductory lines steals my attention right away... xd

i don't know what I exactly should say about this, and I think your detailed post holds a truth to the concepts and way of thinkings. I would not go against that, but I'd rather put forward my own opinions about this, if I may :)

i used to be really pissed off about my work (wallpapers) being uploaded to other sites without my consent, and what not. But, well.. as time goes, and now I have a home (or a wall site), it's kinda pointless for me to go bashing and cursing every ppl who did that (the 'ripping', or so it's called). It will go on and on, and I think it's inevitable because ppl now can easily go to my site, download the wallpaper, and upload it somewhere else,.. it's the internet, for human's sake ^_^'
Nowadays, I prefer to consider that as a form of 'advertisement' for my home site, and that is as long as my signature at the bottom of those walls stay untouched. Most member-uploaded wall sites that I know of usually holds the one with the small resolution version, so I wouldn't mind. In fact, I'd happily let them post it somewhere else if they bother to ask for my permission first.

But indeed, patience has its limits, and if I ever noticed any of my walls in another site, uploaded without my permission, with my signature removed, my wrath is upon them, guaranteed.

After reading that bold line, you might ask, isn't it still against the concept of ripping?, the artwork isn't yours, is it?

That's actually the main reason why most of my newer works are vectors, usually from a re-cg-ed scan, vectored screencaps, and what not. Basically, I re-draw and re-build the scan. (thanks to Tama-Neko-sensei for making vectors a really 'in' thing in wallpaper making) And I now put a copyright disclaimer at the bottom of each wallpapers to justify the fact that I don't claim ownership nor copyrights over the artwork or character portrayed. I believe, my effort is for the sole purpose of advertising the respective series, manga and/or anime.

About MT should have leechers area, I don't have any arguments supporting nor going against that. Fyi, MT is not a l33ch-free area. From the very first existence of MT, one can simply download every damn thing from its servers without compelling to the rules, let alone registering and reaching lv 10. I believe it's called an exploit. I did that long before joining MT, and wayyy long before I reached this level.
I've told Sheq about this. But I believe a total anti-l33ching system is a totally mind-blendering thing to implement, and I'm no web nor programming expert. I'm just pointing that out.
So, actually, l33t l33chers are still able to freely roaming this site excluding that of the formally registered, 10K++ members. That's the fact.

For HQ anime pieces of art
visit : [FRAGMENTS] - www.crash.inweb.dk

Sinistra

Sinistra

MT Fanatic

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*coughs* All images on any website that promotes a culture (i.e.anime, Jpop, etc) this gose for images MP3s wallpapers made by members and what not can be placed under the "Fair Use act" this act gives permission for people to use GFX wallpapers, MP3s to spread the word about a nother culture. IE No copyright infringment is intented. IF the website states they use the Fair Use act The site can't be touched by a copyright holder (i.e. creator, licence,) Most sites like this are there for fun and discussion we aren't making any "money" off the stuff we make so its not like we are stealing anything. it would be totaly different if we were making money of the walls scans and what not we upload

anti-spammers | photoshop-lovers

KorganoS

KorganoS

Busy atm ^_^;;

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Quote by DarkAeonMost sites like this are
there for fun and discussion we aren't making any "money" off the stuff
we make so its not like we are stealing anything. it would be totaly
different if we were making money of the walls & scans


I second that :)
i think it's also the important point that wallpapers and scans that are posted here or everywhere else are free-of-charge, and made by-fans-for-fans. It's not for any commercial purpose.
Thanks for pointing that out... I kinda forgot to include that in my previous post :P

For HQ anime pieces of art
visit : [FRAGMENTS] - www.crash.inweb.dk

kyubinaruto

kyubinaruto

The tabibi gang member

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For all you know, maybe they thought that those websites that ripped our wallpapers are the owner of OUR wallpapers.
I suggest we should make the putting of signatures a must from nowonwards?

Sinistra

Sinistra

MT Fanatic

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all you have to do is you find a rip from MT posted on another site is report the site to their host I have gotten alot of sites shut down that way for ripping off my layouts

anti-spammers | photoshop-lovers

crewcifix

crewcifix

Christian Boy

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Quote by KorganoS

Quote by DarkAeonMost sites like this are
there for fun and discussion we aren't making any "money" off the stuff
we make so its not like we are stealing anything. it would be totaly
different if we were making money of the walls & scans


I second that :)
i think it's also the important point that wallpapers and scans that
are posted here or everywhere else are free-of-charge, and made
by-fans-for-fans. It's not for any commercial purpose.
Thanks for pointing that out... I kinda forgot to include that in my
previous post :P

i agree. Normally saying, I think its really when You use scans/etc. without consent from the creators themselves and make money out of them that could really get you in illegal situations. I second Korgie-kun and DarkAeon's statement for that. =)

And before when i was an icon maker, it really boils my blood having to see my icons everywhere without credit and up t0 now, i still get pissed off however, i just don't have the nerve nor the time to rant about it. :p it's rather pointless anyway. =p

the thing is, once ppl get to see ur work from you, you'd normally have a trademark , maybe a style or two that will determine that it is your work even without the sig being that it ish altered by rippers. :)

Feel the Rain on Your Skin. No One Else can Feel it For You. Only You Can Let it in.
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-=Admin&Mod=- Flip | Ice and Snow | Nippon Foods | TSubasa | Pure Light Love | Assistance Coalescence | Make a Friend | FMWS | Syaoran shrine | Filipino Comm. | Sakura | Sea | Pokemon League | SS shrine | The Real Folk Blues | English | McDonald's

  • Jun 02, 2005

Jim3535

Jim3535

Shinigami

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Fair use is only for US copyright law.

Decisions on whether something falls under fair use are decided by weighing four attributes:
* Purpose and character of the use.
* Nature of the copyrighted work.
* Amount and substantiality of portion used.
* Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

Consider the Kelly v. Arriba Soft Corporation (1999 U.S. App. lexis 1786) case where a photographer challenged a search engine that was using thumbnails of images. The court ruled that it was fair use, but not by much. However, it ruled that inline links that displayed full images were not fair use.

If this case is anything to go by, the use of scanned characters in wallpapers is questionable as far as fair use applys. It would be a tough case, but has the possibility of being won. However, full images such as scans would certainly be denied protection from fair use.

That being said, most countries have what is known as Fair Dealing. I still don't believe that high quality scans of artbooks and other merchandise would be protected.

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DayBreak

DayBreak

The Prince Is Dead

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Quote by Jim3535Fair use is only for US copyright law.
Decisions on whether something falls under fair use are decided by
weighing four attributes:
* Purpose and character of the use.
* Nature of the copyrighted work.
* Amount and substantiality of portion used.
* Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the
copyrighted work.
Consider the
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_v._Arriba_Soft_Corporation]Kelly
v. Arriba Soft Corporation (1999 U.S. App. lexis 1786)[/url] case where
a photographer challenged a search engine that was using thumbnails of
images. The court ruled that it was fair use, but not by much. However,
it ruled that inline links that displayed full images were not fair
use.
If this case is anything to go by, the use of scanned characters in
wallpapers is questionable as far as fair use applys. It would be a
tough case, but has the possibility of being won. However, full images
such as scans would certainly be denied protection from fair use.
That being said, most countries have what is known as
Fair Dealing. I
still don't believe that high quality scans of artbooks and other
merchandise would be protected.

Sir, please. can you put words that i can actually understand?
why in the hell are you comparing stuff in the internet to real life copyright?

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i have such good eyes for spotting talent *-* it never failed me -0- cept for the time when i picked bromit to be staff -0- -Queen Saki

ded113

The Grunge Princess

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Quote by Shadowdude

Quote by Jim3535Fair use is only for US copyright law.
Decisions on whether something falls under fair use are decided by
weighing four attributes:
* Purpose and character of the use.
* Nature of the copyrighted work.
* Amount and substantiality of portion used.
* Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the
copyrighted work.
Consider the
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_v._Arriba_Soft_Corporation]Kelly
v. Arriba Soft Corporation (1999 U.S. App. lexis 1786)[/url] case where
a photographer challenged a search engine that was using thumbnails of
images. The court ruled that it was fair use, but not by much. However,
it ruled that inline links that displayed full images were not fair
use.
If this case is anything to go by, the use of scanned characters in
wallpapers is questionable as far as fair use applys. It would be a
tough case, but has the possibility of being won. However, full images
such as scans would certainly be denied protection from fair use.
That being said, most countries have what is known as
Fair Dealing. I
still don't believe that high quality scans of artbooks and other
merchandise would be protected.

Sir, please. can you put words that i can actually understand?
why in the hell are you comparing stuff in the internet to real life copyright?

Amen!! That's what I want to know!! I don't see anything remotely that have to do with the real life!! Please if you're going to comment something, MAKE sense!

DayBreak

DayBreak

The Prince Is Dead

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Sir, there's a whole alot of reason's you need to know about the wallers you've mentioned.
HA, thats a great way to make you look as an ***hole of your self.
Heres some reason's they might not like people uploading their walls.
1.They might like to keep their walls solely to their site only, if they have one.
2. You did not ask permission.

Done heres the other part, if its so wrong to upload scans from artbooks etc.
whats the point of the artist to sell them? is it cause they were bored? NO, they
wanted to advertise their works buddy. you get what i mean?

P.S:Sir, you uploaded scan's your self. you hypricrate. So whats the point of this damn entire thread?!

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i have such good eyes for spotting talent *-* it never failed me -0- cept for the time when i picked bromit to be staff -0- -Queen Saki

ded113

The Grunge Princess

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Couldn't have said it better myself Shadow. You posted scans as well so you're no different than the ppl that post them! I don't see the point you are tryin to make but it's useless to think that it has some value to it. Please. Cry me a river elsewhere where because we all hear that song before.

BTW. Sooner or later this thread WILL close and I sincerley hope so!! If you want to make threads that are interesting, words of advice: Make threads that are worth everyone's time!

Celessa

Retired Moderator

Celessa

Okaerinasai - Welcome Home

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Quote by Jim3535The complaints in ripping threads are extremely out of control. People resort to flaming, bashing, threatening personal injury, making allusions to preparing weapons to smite them with, etc. Yes I'm looking at you eunasahng, exentric, Criox, Vinitachi, GintheTwilightswords, Aa-chan, breadcrust, streamside, Anjeile, Teryon, Odysseus, white-zero, satan123, stellar, kuroimisa, diamarrr, wuschel, and many others. It's not just contained to the threads either people are advocating going to the offending websites and bashing / flaming the users / admins there. Have you no dignity and self control? You look like a bunch of winy little brats trying to form a lynch mob. Not to mention posting comments like "man, can't anyone do something about this" do absolutely nothing to help, but rather just add clutter and take up space. Why not listen to Biri and act with a bit of dignity?

I believe your point does clearly make sense.

Apparently, Biri's approach was the best after all. Rather than bash members and burn them from elsewhere, why not politely ask the community to take them down? If they laugh back at your face, however, believe me, it'd be one chaotic battle over another, here.

Provoking one's actions is like getting bitten back. It's a completely dangerous cause-and-effect, really.

Quote by Jim3535The best way to fight any problem is to go for the source. The primary motivation to upload wallpapers to these distro sites is because MT is so locked down. I propose creating an AD supported mirror of MT that is for unregistered users. It would contain the wallpapers and possibly greatly reduced quality scans that are free for any visitor to get. It isn't hard to have a website that is completely ad supported, especially if more annoying and higher paying ads are displayed. This would have absolutely no effect on normal members who have registered.

This might not be related to Minitokyo at all, but my site can relate, since it is a somewhat moderate community.

Actually, when I revealed JAN itself within Japan, I started back with a rule of policies that were to be easily maintained. The restrictions had to be put into play, because there should be a fine line between giving off little bandwidth, and spending far too much. A bit of coding had to be tweaked to make sure no one was directly linking these images from our pictures.

Yes, it was a pay-free site where nothing severe was actually allowed. People were free to submit their favorite idols through anything that they wished [as long as they abided by the rules], though leeching were limited to 25 downloads a day. The full advertisements did serve very well in the cause, paying for a lot of the costs, and most people were humble with the high quality pictures given from within the site, that it all went very well from time to time. Not many questioned about the limitations, since everyone had the chance to get their hands on these pictures right away. Of course, the policy clearly states in a kind fashion, why such limitations were put into play. I've seen sites who allow users to download an infinite amount of pics. Good thing? Questioned - bad move indeed. We're not rich, apparently. **Shrugs** We're going through the same situation ourselves, but its not to a point where it makes it a complete inconvenience to other members, really. Everyone was treated as of equal. Just a register and they're good to go. **Nods** But still, no matter what, don't you forget that rules still need to be made. We can't feed the poor with an unlimited supply of bread, that none of us even have. Know what I'm saying? So yes, sacrifices had to be made, unfortunately enough. That's the way these more popular sites go, and no, these problems won't end then and there. It's to be expected. Who'd give away free stuff [no hold bars, unlimited downloading] - like all the time? Not many, believe me. Too many eventually die off that way. It's best to take advantage with what you got. [By the way, this doesn't have anything to do with MT - just a way I approached from administrating a website myself.]

Quote by Jim3535Fair use is only for US copyright law.
Decisions on whether something falls under fair use are decided by
weighing four attributes:
* Purpose and character of the use.
* Nature of the copyrighted work.
* Amount and substantiality of portion used.
* Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the
copyrighted work.
Consider the
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_v._Arriba_Soft_Corporation]Kelly
v. Arriba Soft Corporation (1999 U.S. App. lexis 1786)[/url] case where
a photographer challenged a search engine that was using thumbnails of
images. The court ruled that it was fair use, but not by much. However,
it ruled that inline links that displayed full images were not fair
use.
If this case is anything to go by, the use of scanned characters in
wallpapers is questionable as far as fair use applys. It would be a
tough case, but has the possibility of being won. However, full images
such as scans would certainly be denied protection from fair use.
That being said, most countries have what is known as
Fair Dealing. I
still don't believe that high quality scans of artbooks and other
merchandise would be protected.

Speaking of which, Fair Use actually does fall into our category as well.

Scans from photobooks are considered okay for Japanese Idols since mainly it was shown off multiple sites as a way to advertise or promote publicity through these pictures.

By promoting publicity, there's no actual restriction in the way people can use these scans for certain wallpaper usage, collages, and the works. We never really had to go through such legality issues because they too are shown in other sites, and were evidently allowed. As such, this meant that any other site could have a hold of these images, since no evident declaration of restrictions [towards specific websites] were to be made as well. Besides, ours have many image galleries from these sites all collided to our own, so nothing big, really. Thus, Fair Use was implemented in every way here.

And yes, if someone took photos that they claim as their own, without any permission or consent - if they wish that it would be taken off the site, by all means, that's perfectly alright. It's theirs, not ours.

"No matter where you go, no matter how tough life may be, just remember that always in your heart, you will still be loved."

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DayBreak

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The Prince Is Dead

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Quote by Celessa

Quote by Jim3535The complaints in ripping threads are extremely out of
control. People resort to flaming, bashing, threatening personal
injury, making allusions to preparing weapons to smite them with, etc.
Yes I'm looking at you eunasahng, exentric, Criox, Vinitachi,
GintheTwilightswords, Aa-chan, breadcrust, streamside, Anjeile, Teryon,
Odysseus, white-zero, satan123, stellar, kuroimisa, diamarrr, wuschel,
and many others. It's not just contained to the threads either people
are advocating going to the offending websites and bashing / flaming
the users / admins there. Have you no dignity and self control? You
look like a bunch of winy little brats trying to form a lynch mob. Not
to mention posting comments like "man, can't anyone do something about
this" do absolutely nothing to help, but rather just add clutter and
take up space. Why not listen to Biri and act with a bit of
dignity?

I believe your point does clearly make sense.
Apparently, Biri's approach was the best after all. Rather than bash
members and burn them from elsewhere, why not politely ask the
community to take them down? If they laugh back at your face, however,
believe me, it'd be one chaotic battle over another, here.
Provoking one's actions is like getting bitten back. It's a completely
dangerous cause-and-effect, really.

Quote by Jim3535The best way to fight any problem is to go for the
source. The primary motivation to upload wallpapers to these distro
sites is because MT is so locked down. I propose creating an AD
supported mirror of MT that is for unregistered users. It would contain
the wallpapers and possibly greatly reduced quality scans that are free
for any visitor to get. It isn't hard to have a website that is
completely ad supported, especially if more annoying and higher paying
ads are displayed. This would have absolutely no effect on normal
members who have registered.

Actually, when I revealed JAN
itself within Japan, I started back with a rule of policies that were
to be easily maintained. The restrictions had to be put into play,
because there should be a fine line between giving off little
bandwidth, and spending far too much. A bit of coding had to be tweaked
to make sure no one was directly linking these images from our
pictures.
Yes, it was a pay-free site where nothing severe was actually allowed.
People were free to submit their favorite idols through anything that
they wished [as long as they abided by the rules], though leeching were
limited to 25 downloads a day. The full advertisements did serve very
well in the cause, paying for a lot of the costs, and most people were
humble with the high quality pictures given from within the site, that
it all went very well from time to time. Not many questioned about the
limitations, since everyone had the chance to get their hands on these
pictures right away. Of course, the policy clearly states in a kind
fashion, why such limitations were put into play. I've seen sites who
allow users to download an infinite amount of pics. Good thing?
Questioned - bad move indeed. We're not rich, apparently. **Shrugs**
We're going through the same situation ourselves, but its not to a
point where it makes it a complete inconvenience to other members,
really. Everyone was treated equal. Just a register and they're good to
go. **Nods**

Quote by Jim3535Fair use is only for US copyright law.
Decisions on whether something falls under fair use are decided by
weighing four attributes:
* Purpose and character of the use.
* Nature of the copyrighted work.
* Amount and substantiality of portion used.
* Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the
copyrighted work.
Consider the
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_v._Arriba_Soft_Corporation]Kelly
v. Arriba Soft Corporation (1999 U.S. App. lexis 1786)[/url] case where
a photographer challenged a search engine that was using thumbnails of
images. The court ruled that it was fair use, but not by much. However,
it ruled that inline links that displayed full images were not fair
use.
If this case is anything to go by, the use of scanned characters in
wallpapers is questionable as far as fair use applys. It would be a
tough case, but has the possibility of being won. However, full images
such as scans would certainly be denied protection from fair use.
That being said, most countries have what is known as
Fair Dealing. I
still don't believe that high quality scans of artbooks and other
merchandise would be protected.

Speaking of which, Fair Use
actually does fall into our category as well.
Scans from photobooks are considered okay for Japanese Idols since
mainly it was shown off multiple sites as a way to advertise or promote
publicity through these pictures.
By promoting publicity, there's no actual restriction in the way people
can use these scans for certain wallpaper usage, collages, and the
works. We never really had to go through such legality issues because
they too are shown in other sites. Ours have many image galleries from
these sites all collided to our own, so nothing big, really. Thus, Fair
Use was implemented in every way here.
And yes, if someone took photos that they claim as their own, if they
wish that it would be taken off the site, by all means, that's
perfectly alright, by all means.

Celessa, this is why your my idol :3 *gets a flag* *fanboy celessa*
well anyway, nice point there.

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i have such good eyes for spotting talent *-* it never failed me -0- cept for the time when i picked bromit to be staff -0- -Queen Saki

crewcifix

crewcifix

Christian Boy

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good point Celessa.

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  • Jun 03, 2005

Jinzhou

Retired Moderator

Jinzhou

Forsaken God

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Ok, so I should basically be able to ban you on the spot right now, along with everyone else right? Distro is still an active form of ripping. See the pretty scans on your page? Those are distributed without the authors permission. See your doujin artwork? Who gave you permission to recreate copywritten artwork?

A distro is a rip, through and through. This is because most people aren't smart enough to read the rules that clearly state any work on this website MUST be by you and not an unaltered form of artwork.

But, here in-lies the problem. Technically anything put on this website is a rip because it's someone elses artwork. But under a good-faith type of understanding it is allowed to represent a purely artistic value. But when you rip someone elses wallpaper (the artwork they did plus the 'official' work), it is disgraceful, whiether a rip or a distro.

So please, before putting down a site, think about what it gives you over what it doesn't.

And as always...if you see a rip, report it... FTW!

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Sinistra

Sinistra

MT Fanatic

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Quote by JinzhouOk, so I should basically be able to ban you on the spot right now,
along with everyone else right? Distro is still an active form of
ripping. See the pretty scans on your page? Those are distributed
without the authors permission. See your doujin artwork? Who gave you
permission to recreate copywritten artwork?
A distro is a rip, through and through. This is because most people
aren't smart enough to read the rules that clearly state any work on
this website MUST be by you and not an unaltered form of artwork.
But, here in-lies the problem. Technically anything put on this website
is a rip because it's someone elses artwork. But under a good-faith
type of understanding it is allowed to represent a purely artistic
value. But when you rip someone elses wallpaper (the artwork they did
plus the 'official' work), it is disgraceful, whiether a rip or a
distro.
So please, before putting down a site, think about what it gives you
over what it doesn't.
And as always...if you see a rip, report it... FTW!


AMEN! I agree with Jinzhou If your going to complain about MT being a ripped site Everyone on the site would have to be ban. I read through MTs policy and it dose state "in genera" that stuff posted on the site is purely for artistic reason. there is nothing wrong with that not in the little bit BUT if someone rips a wall off MT without artist permission THEN we can complain about ripping

anti-spammers | photoshop-lovers

Jim3535

Jim3535

Shinigami

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In case you haven't noticed, the internet exists in the real world.

Quote by ShadowdudeDone heres the other part, if its so wrong to upload scans from artbooks etc.
whats the point of the artist to sell them? is it cause they were bored? NO, they
wanted to advertise their works buddy. you get what i mean?

P.S:Sir, you uploaded scan's your self. you hypricrate. So whats the point of this damn entire thread?!


I have never claimed that it was right or proper to upload those scans. I uploaded them because I wished to share them with people who might make wallpapers with those images. My point about the scans is that people who approve of uploading these types of works should not be the ones who complain about others distributing their walls (so long as they are unmodified and give credit).

Celessa: I don't believe that just because past acts haven't resulted it action or punishment that the behavior does not break the rules. If I was genuinely worried about the copyright holders coming down on this site then I would have not uploaded the scans. However, that still doesn't make it right.

Quote by ded113BTW. Sooner or later this thread WILL close and I sincerley hope so!!
If you want to make threads that are interesting, words of advice: Make
threads that are worth everyone's time!


If people insist on spamming and turning it into a flame war, then I am sure you are right. However, if MT members are capable of having a respectable discussion, then that is far less likely to happen. As I said in the disclaimer, I knew this was going to upset some people, but I deemed it necessary.

The bottom line is that I feel that many MT users are living in their own bubble as Shadowdude pointed out. Why not establish a consistent set of morals for yourself and abide by them? Why is it ok for you to distribute someones work without asking permission but not ok for someone else to do the same to yours? You either accept it as I have done, or you condemn it and do not practice in it. As for distributing walls without permission, I do not endorse or condemn or practice in it. My gripe is with how (some) people react to it.

[edit]

Quote: Ok, so I should basically be able to ban you on the spot right now, along with everyone else right? Distro is still an active form of ripping. See the pretty scans on your page? Those are distributed without the authors permission. See your doujin artwork? Who gave you permission to recreate copywritten artwork?


That's exactly my point. According to the rules everyone is breaking the rules. Shouldn't they at least be consistent enough so that isn't the case?

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crewcifix

crewcifix

Christian Boy

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Let me answer some of that.... I'm trying my best to be friendly, ok? :)

Quote by Jim3535Why not establish a consistent set of morals for yourself and abide by them? Why is it ok for you to distribute someones work without asking permission but not ok for someone else to do the same to yours?


I would just like to point out that most wallers, if not, give due credit to the anime being referred to. They do not claim it to be their own. MT is also able to provide the right Titles where most of the anime walls are categorized. However, much like them as an artist, if their works are to be stolen, or miscredited, then I guess that's just how majority of MT Wallers would react.

>< I dunno if I made sense. Gomen ne.

I do not really support flaming though as it is not very appropriate nor is it civilized.. (sp?) but the right for the artist to still claim ownership over her work should still be acceptable. imho. :)

p.s. I still abide by KorganoS opinion. People who take works, my works, without credit or anything are to suffer the wrath of God... in proper ways of course that would hopefully not resort to inecessary flame wars.

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  • Jun 03, 2005

Celessa

Retired Moderator

Celessa

Okaerinasai - Welcome Home

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In due respects, I can only answer your part which you have addressed to me, over here.

Quote by Jim3535Celessa: I don't believe that just because past acts haven't resulted
it action or punishment that the behavior does not break the rules. If I was genuinely worried about the copyright holders coming down on this site then I would have not uploaded the scans. However, that still doesn't make it right.

Neither do I, but neither had I recognized this sort of behavior to be existant around, either. If you think that this behavior should be fixed, or that it had gone too far, why not settle back and use the Support Inquiry on the site, then complain this under the "Forum" section? It would have been better executed in private with a moderator there, rather than having to turn a lot of heads in public, really.

Anyways, I'm not just saying that you are making the situation any better, believe me. In the rules of the forums, pointing out people's names directly, just like the example of a quote I will state from you below, is sort of like a form of directly attacking someone and this definitely could be considered crossing such a respectable line, yourself. The way you mentioned previously about them, believe me, is indecent and rude as it already is, and I consider that no different than the disruptive behavior from other complainers as well, although I hate to admit that they may generally be in fault, too. Believe me, fussing about other people who fuss around isn't always the best solution, and it's not going to win you any points towards a pretty rewarding discussion, you know. It's a shame, really. I hope I'm not offending you in any way.

Quote by Jim3535Have you no dignity and self control? You look like a bunch of winy little brats trying to form a lynch mob.

As in kind, and as a former member, please try your best not to let this go over your head. You said what you had to say. That's all. Don't make things worse as it already is.

Anyways, of course, I would understand that some of these members would be completely frustrated if their walls weren't credited enough, but apparently since I'm not a wallpaper artist over here [I only follow suit with J-Pop Idols distributions], I don't fall under this jurisdiction here, so I can't really fuss about it, really. **Shrugs** I wouldn't even know how these artists would feel, so I'll back away from any further discussions. **Nods** I suppose the rest of my input won't be necessary here.

"No matter where you go, no matter how tough life may be, just remember that always in your heart, you will still be loved."

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crewcifix

crewcifix

Christian Boy

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phew i'm glad i didn't do a double post ><

good points again Celessa! =)

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  • Jun 03, 2005

calisqo

calisqo

::RERAITO::

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I used to think that having your walls distributed on a web should be an honor >.>
First , because people like it ^_^ , it think that what make the wallers happy <.<
And i believe i mentioned that few times to my fellow mt'ers as cel >.< , shuei etc >.<

However ........
Sadly, to hear that u mentioned wall shouldn't have signature T.T

i believe we "wallers" don't get paid for doing this, nor MT for distributing such scans etc relating to anime, we are simply a bunch of fans outside JApan who appreciate anime for being there, "hoping oneday anime would be as famous in our country as it is in Japan".

Putting our signature in it simply just a remainder for people , "saying" that wall was made by us >.> and we did our best on promoting such anime T.T , We don't want someone else take credit, please understand >.> try to make your own wall , you'll see what i mean >.<

Sure u can take it and distribute it somewhere else..... but the signature should still be intact and I believe fellows wallers would like it in 100% condition not altered or anything. And we aware of this ,we know by distributing it on the net, will create such fuss like this <.< but who to blame ?

However you EVER use anyone's else wallpapers , have u ever felt thankful for them anyway? I'm actually thankful for Tama's FMA wall and Jinzhou's Fractal walls >.>,i know that i couldn't buy wallpaper that good >.> , i don't even know anywhere , where people sell wallpapers (for PC that is XD )?
Or do u just use it? not thinkning where it's coming from?Anyway >.< that's my opinion take it lightly ^____^

DayBreak

DayBreak

The Prince Is Dead

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Quote by Jim3535In case you haven't noticed, the internet exists in the real world.

Quote by ShadowdudeDone heres the other part, if its so wrong to upload
scans from artbooks etc.
whats the point of the artist to sell them? is it cause they were
bored? NO, they
wanted to advertise their works buddy. you get what i mean?
P.S:Sir, you uploaded scan's your self. you hypricrate. So whats the
point of this damn entire thread?!


I have never claimed that it was right or proper to upload those scans.
I uploaded them because I wished to share them with people who might
make wallpapers with those images. My point about the scans is that
people who approve of uploading these types of works should not be the
ones who complain about others distributing their walls (so long as
they are unmodified and give credit).
Celessa: I don't believe that just because past acts haven't resulted
it action or punishment that the behavior does not break the rules. If
I was genuinely worried about the copyright holders coming down on this
site then I would have not uploaded the scans. However, that still
doesn't make it right.

Quote by ded113BTW. Sooner or later this thread WILL close and I
sincerley hope so!!
If you want to make threads that are interesting, words of advice: Make
threads that are worth everyone's time!


If people insist on spamming and turning it into a flame war, then I am
sure you are right. However, if MT members are capable of having a
respectable discussion, then that is far less likely to happen. As I
said in the disclaimer, I knew this was going to upset some people, but
I deemed it necessary. The bottom line is that I feel that many MT
users are living in their own bubble as Shadowdude pointed out. Why not
establish a consistent set of morals for yourself and abide by them?
Why is it ok for you to distribute someones work without asking
permission but not ok for someone else to do the same to yours? You
either accept it as I have done, or you condemn it and do not practice
in it. As for distributing walls without permission, I do not endorse
or condemn or practice in it. My gripe is with how (some) people react
to it.
[edit]

Quote: Ok, so I should basically be able to ban you on the spot right
now, along with everyone else right? Distro is still an active form of
ripping. See the pretty scans on your page? Those are distributed
without the authors permission. See your doujin artwork? Who gave you
permission to recreate copywritten artwork?


That's exactly my point. According to the rules everyone is breaking
the rules. Shouldn't they at least be consistent enough so that isn't
the case?

what in the hell are you talking about? look at your self with the scans in your gallery.
you uploaded them selfs with no permission from the artist?!
Then whats the freakin point of dishing out this worthless points when it will only backfire on you?

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