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Virginia Tech Shooting

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I admit, what I read about in the news, see the news on the television, makes me feel very sad. Even though I don't know any of these people who died at the hands of a "Madman", the actions of one person , thru the acts of violence can sow the seeds of hate, fear, ignorance on all of us.
These persons who died at the hands of a murderous man, one has to ask, "What can we do as a Society see to it that it will never happen again ?"
Okay, tighter gun control laws, which is fine for the authorities. They get to control the "sheep" (Society). What about the wolves, (the criminals who don't adhere to the gun control laws) ? They do what they want as long as they don't get caught.
This will not be the last time, a murderous person, possesed by rage and hate toward his / her fellow Human being will inflict a life changing event on all.
I fear, another event will happen, either a "copycat" event or a bigger one will happen.
My prayers go out to those who died in the carnage, the family members who lost their loved ones and to the family of the lone gunman. All are hurting. Even though we as a Society and as a individual, we must see past the hurt, the anger to be able to heal and understand.
Perhaps, I am a idealist, a man who lives in a "rose shaded" world. I want to live in a world, free from hate, from sadness, from violence. Is a crime to want to live in a world free from violence and replace it with real peace and love ?

eXDream2K5

eXDream2K5

the crazy band geek

I was asleep when the shootings occurred, and I didn't hear anything about it until I was on my way to my math class at 1pm.

As a college student myself, this has left me positively horrified. As a member of my college's student newspaper, I am working tirelessly with my colleagues to expose the lax security on my campus.

Monday was not a good day for me at all, and it capped off a pretty shitty week, but to know that 32 innocent people, 3 or 4 of which were professors and the remaining 28 being students...I sat there with my mom, watching CNN, MSNBC over and over for updates, crying all the while. It's horrendous, it's inexcusible. I have been trying for the past day to understand why something like this would happen. My mom was in a similar position as I am back in the 80s; her co-workers were brutally murdered in the research lab at the hospital where she worked. The murders are still unsolved. She told me that even 20 years later, she can't understand why someone would slaughter those people; they were all well-liked, they never bothered anyone, and the night they were killed, they were just minding their business, doing their jobs.

Yesterday's shootings were just as scary for her, because she is the mother of a college student, soon two college students, because my brother will start college next fall. The thought of having to bury one's child is indeed frightening. The thought of burying my brother is frightening, and I'm sure the thought of burying me is frightening for my brother as well. Putting myself in my mother's shoes, it would kill me to have to bury a child. I can only imagine the grief the families are feeling.

Guns should be outlawed. Only the police and the military should have them. If you want to be able to defend yourself, take martial arts lessons. Learn the fighting skills necessary to defend yourself, but only use them for self-defense. Fighting guns with guns is like war, and as Bertrand Russell said, "War does not determine who is right -- only who is left."

Labels are for cans. I'm not a f*cking can.

LigerZSchnider

LigerZSchnider

Litterbox Trained........

I don't care how tight the gun law gets; eventually someone will get a hold of a firearm who has snapped. Anyone seen the picture of the suspect yet? Yeah he's Korean.....way out of the box for a psychopath, a thug, or a gang member. Just an ordinary kid from another country with no friends or family who just snapped. Any gun store owner and any background check would not have stopped this guy. The worse thing is anyone is susceptable, and have an arsenal in their garage! No matter who you are: man, woman or child.....when you snap, you are gonna take others with you.

Take firearms away, and the underground will get stronger. Let anyone own firearms, this and even worse tragadies will follow.... what we all need to be is more friendlier to others and not nastier, or be quicker on your feet and have a sharper mind to recognize when a disaster is about to happen.

"In the absence of orders, find something and kill it" - Erwin Rommel

maverickmechanic

maverickmechanic

Absurd Insanity

here is a story in japan where they have very strict gun laws and the mayor has been shot by the mob.
Link just more proof that outlawing guns will not stop gun crime

merged: 04-18-2007 ~ 08:02pm

Quote by Ochibi-sanSelf defense is a whole different issue. Defending others is with that too. I most likely have been exposed to more violence then any of you here, and yes, I can honesty say, violence is not the answer. Not only because it more than likely not solve anything, it'll cause greater damage.

violence is violence no matter the situation. yes, deffending others is a good thing, but someone is still going to die or be hurt. I probably would have been shot had i been there because i proabably would have tried something to stop him. I'd much rather die than sit on the floor, not doing anything, while my classmates and friends are being slaughtered, but i can also understand why nothing was done. The students were fearing for their lives, trying to avoid not being shot. Then fear and self preservation takes over your mind, the fight or flight response and in most cases, flight will take effect before fight will.

Quote by LigerZSchnider...or be quicker on your feet and have a sharper mind to recognize when a disaster is about to happen.

exactly.

Signature ImageThere was glitter everywhere! It looked like somebody stabbed a pixie.
Roadie of .::DarK LeaF::.

starrliteangel

starrliteangel

Rabi to rabu rabu <3

Well, its a lot easier to say something than to do it you know. I see some people saying that they would stand up and defend themselves against a madman if they had a gun, but how many of us have actually done that? Ive never had to do that, and I hope I never will have to. Defending yourself against a madman and hunting animals/shooting ranges are two totally different things. No one is immune to fear, and once fear kicks in...I dont know how many people would really be able to stand up and shoot him down.

Yea, I heard about that mayor getting shot in Japan. Actually, Ive been going to japan every summer, but Ive never noticed the thing about strict gun laws. First of all, I must say that Japan is totally different from the US. Not many people there go hunting for deer (or other animals), so not many japanese people have the need for a gun anyways.
Like the article says, the yakuza are the ones that carry the guns. The article also says that

Quote:
The attack came despite a sharp drop in shootings in recent years.

The number of reported gun attacks have plunged from 158 in 2002

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avatar and sigimg by - kawaii-chicken the greatness

Part of the problem in the US is that firearms dealres make big bussiness based in a obsolete constitutional rigth: that everyone have to get a weapon to defend theirselves... during the US independence war.

It doesn't mean that people have to be defenseless against criminals. Just that in such an open market people with mental or nervous disorders get easy access to firearms. Despite the firearms sellers (who sometimes are as looney as the phsycos that shoot), the buying of a gun should be more restricted.

Maybe creating a database with medical information, so it would be more difficult for people with mental disorders to get a weapon.


merged: 04-19-2007 ~ 01:55am

Quote: People are going to get guns illegally whether we relax the gun laws or whether we make them stricter. Criminals are just like that. I doubt criminals are going to go to a shop and get themselves registered for a gun.

Not outlawing, but making it more difficult, and as you say, reduce it. A robber or a gangster is not going to register, it's going to buy it in the black market. But keep in mind that your average criminal has a goal in mind: steal, menace, self-protection. Of course, murder also goes there, but the criminal selects his/her victim.

The student was a person with mental and social problems. But he bougth the wapon legally, he wasn't a professional criminal neither, and made a lot of damage anyway. The goal here is to restrict the sales of firearms to people like him.

***

Lert's pray for the souls of the victims, innocent people in the wrong time and place, for the peace of mind of the survivors, and yes, even for he who felt so traped in the tortures of his own mind that couldn't find a true way out.

Very scary. I really don't know what to say about it.

As for the firearm issue, like many before me, I definitely think that banning guns won't do any good. Many people obtain their guns illegally anyways. If a criminal really wants to get a gun, there's no stopping him or her--obtaining one nowadays is just too easy.

maverickmechanic

maverickmechanic

Absurd Insanity

Quote by starrliteangelWell, its a lot easier to say something than to do it you know. I see some people saying that they would stand up and defend themselves against a madman if they had a gun, but how many of us have actually done that? Ive never had to do that, and I hope I never will have to. Defending yourself against a madman and hunting animals/shooting ranges are two totally different things. No one is immune to fear, and once fear kicks in...I dont know how many people would really be able to stand up and shoot him down.


i understnad the fear thing. i'd would be scared, believe me, but i have also had training to calm myself down, think clearly, and react to a situation (martial arts can do that to you).

Quote: Yea, I heard about that mayor getting shot in Japan. Actually, Ive been going to japan every summer, but Ive never noticed the thing about strict gun laws. First of all, I must say that Japan is totally different from the US. Not many people there go hunting for deer (or other animals), so not many japanese people have the need for a gun anyways.
Like the article says, the yakuza are the ones that carry the guns. The article also says that

Quote:
The attack came despite a sharp drop in shootings in recent years.

The number of reported gun attacks have plunged from 158 in 2002

Signature ImageThere was glitter everywhere! It looked like somebody stabbed a pixie.
Roadie of .::DarK LeaF::.

ladestiny92

ladestiny92

We can protect each other

I just read about the shooting in the newspaper this afternoon when I got back from school...
So scary that someone have the guts to shoot innocent people like that...
After that, he also shoot himself...*sigh*
I wonder why he had to do something like that?
He's still 23 after all.....
In the newspaper, it say maybe it has something to do with depression..I don't know.
But if his depress, go and talk to someone...
Its no use destroying ur own future and 32 others like that.

Please join various~ANME~fanfics group...^^,

EternalParadox

Retired Moderator

EternalParadox

.:Enigma Mod:.

Quote: new idea: after the release of the info on his mental state (this kid had disturbed thoughts, weird writtings, even an imaginary girlfriend...) i think that while a criminal background check is a good idea, it does not cover everything. I think there should be a detailed mental health record for everyone and that should be throughly reviewed before the weapon can be issued (you wouldn't go to wal-mart and ask the gun attendent, while handeling a weapon, where the anit-depressents are) and maybe even a competency test every couple years (i mean i have to have someone testify that they have seen me weld in what i am certifited to weld in every year to keep the certifacation). now this may be in breach of the 5 amendment, but it could reduce some of the shootings where mentally disturbed people are involved.

I disagree with this approach. Rather than drawing the line at the gun shop, we ought to draw the line at the very first instance that people notice that there is a problem with an individual so that such people would not even get the chance to go to the gun shop in the first place.

One crucial piece of information that has emerged in this case is that he had been referred to counseling and was even admitted to a mental health institution in 2005. That mean that one and a half years ago it was already recognize that Cho had mental problems.

However, we also know that the VT counseling center was legally restricted in their options; they could not do anything unless he made an "explicit" threat to others or himself. That approach is I believe the reason this entire massacre occurred. A university too fearful of political correctness did nothing to help Cho because they feared the legal consequences.

Had the university forcibly entered Cho into counseling and a mental institution, and had he been forced to stay until he was clinically shown to be cured of the problems, he would still be in that mental institution today and 33 lives, including his, would be saved. That gun shop owner would not be feeling the guilt of selling him the Glock. Families would not be grieving. Friends would not be suffering.

I fully support an approach where when a teacher or professional identifies a potentially mentally sick individual, that they be forced to go into a mental health facility and be made to stay until clinically cured. All this talk of "we can't do anything unless he comes to us" is nonsense. We know by countless examples that depressed and other mentally ill individuals will NOT go seek professional help by themselves. Waiting until they come by their own accord is to wait for another Va. Tech massacre.

EternalParadox
Previously the Forum, Vector Art, and Policy Moderator

Duuz

Duuz

Master of Disaster

More gun control is not the answer. What you are seeing and what the media isn't telling you is the system had failed somewhere to enforce the law.

You see our crazed shooter in the VT shootings was ordered by a court to get psychiatric help. They did and evaluated him as a danger to himself and others, but wait this gets better. Virginia state gun laws has on the books a law that a person ordered/forced to go to psychiatric help by doctors or the state is inelegable to buy a handgun.

So my question is this, who failed to put him into the system so when a state and federal background check was done when he was buying a handgun showed nothing? He should never have been allowed to buy those guns in the first place. More laws are not needed, what's needed is to enforce the laws on the books! What is also needed is to hold the authorities that failed to do their jobs responsible for this. Some one needs to loose their job over this.

Be it the judge or clerk that may have failed to enter this info into the system, the psychiatist that might have withheld this information because of doctor/patient privacy rights, the politicians that made the laws that restricted the VT councilers. Some where the system failed and all because of Political Correctness, can't do anything to offend him after all.

The system failed, guns are not to blame, access to guns is not the problem, the gun laws are not the problem, the gun dealer is not to blame.

If the law was enforced none of this would have happened.

In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same.

UberDog

UberDog

I Walk Alone...

merged: 04-20-2007 ~ 09:50pm
The Simple Solution: Stop the HATE! :( :\ :\

Knowledge and Time are the Keys to Wisdom.Signature Image

EarthAngel1

EarthAngel1

Hero's Aren't born their made

Well i when i saw the picture of that guy and his diary.(if only that tape had arrived a few days sooner they would have know what he was up to)but to me to me the guy looked insane when i 1st saw him. it's to bad they were able to catch him just so the families of people he hurt could make him suffer the same way. but i prey for the friends and families of that incident and hope everything for them turns out ok.

Quote by EarthAngel1Well i when i saw the picture of that guy and his diary.(if only that tape had arrived a few days sooner they would have know what he was up to)but to me to me the guy looked insane when i 1st saw him. it's to bad they were able to catch him just so the families of people he hurt could make him suffer the same way. but i prey for the friends and families of that incident and hope everything for them turns out ok.

Well for the truth, he sent it just before he went off with his plan. Even though he was mentally ill and had disturbing thoughts, he had it all planned. He didn't send it days before the massacre but rather he sent it on the same day of the VT massacre.
So it couldn't be stopped.

And what do you mean by this:

Quote by EarthAngel1
it's to bad they were able to catch him just so the families of people he hurt could make him suffer the same way.

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+ Latest Work.:A Dying Friend

Lionhearted911

Lionhearted911

~:. LioNe$s .:~

what a surprise! i just watched the insider on this incident two days ago! well violence only breeds more violence... here guns are banned and such stories don't take place as often
i think there should be stricter laws on who can carry guns, just like those who drive cars have to go through tests and so on, i think it should be the same for guns XD
well...i sure hope things like this don't take place again...really is a sad event...
RIP Virginia-Tech Victims...

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FaMiLy MeAn$ NoBoDy GeTs LefT BeHinD 0r ... FoRgoTTen ... ^^

If ppl wanna live in a safe place, "no weapons = no danger and more weapons = more killing n making the place not safe" so in my own opinion I think they should do sumthing about the gun. Is way too easy for ppl to get a gun over here.

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ThndRwv5

I'm not really sure about this since it has its good side to own a gun and its good side not to. But I think I have enough of guns kill people so all guns should be banned for the better. And the possibility to live will be reduced if the killer use a gun. How can we dodge a bullet? If it's a knife, then we still have some chance.

EternalParadox

Retired Moderator

EternalParadox

.:Enigma Mod:.

Bumping of old thread. Discussion of gun control can be done in the gun control thread.

Closed.

EternalParadox
Previously the Forum, Vector Art, and Policy Moderator

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