"Bush Warmonger " & "Darth Chaney" for World Domination!

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Quote by Absentmindederic
Quote by Vagrant123As my mother would say, "We won't know if he was a
good president or not until at least 50 years from now."

My history teacher has told me that many times too, and the same with
any historical event. Who knows, maybe something that Bush did actually
savved our @$$es but we just don't know it. Maybe - as horrible and
horrendous as this may sound, please don't take it the wrong way, but
I'm just saying - that one of the people killed in the war in Iraq was
goinng to be the next Osama bin Laden. But we'll never know. All we can....
.

The reverse can also be true. Perhaps one of the things Bush did will bring tragedy to the US. And I can sure name quite and awfully lot of things that Bush, in particular did that will create confict for America in the future. Say for example alienating the rest of the whole god damn world. Fighting terroism is a responsibility that can only be handled by the multitude of countries in the world, not ONE single country. This is a very obvious fact yet, strangely, Bush doesn't seem to realize this.

How exactly is Bush a good president, I'll like any Bush supporter to explain why they support him;
http://slindseynew.it-mitc.louisville.edu/Personal/accomplishmentsOfBush.html

Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the president or any other public official, save exactly to the degree in which he himself stands by the country. It is patriotic to support him insofar as he efficiently serves the country. It is unpatriotic not to oppose him to the exact extent that by inefficiency or otherwise he fails in his duty to stand by the country. In either event, it is unpatriotic not to tell the truth, whether about the president or anyone else.
- Theodore Roosevelt

EDIT:
"Why of course the people don't want war. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
-Hermann Goering,
Nazi officer,
during his Nuremberg war crimes trial

- R. K. Kishore

Nov 06, 2004
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Vagrant123 I'm having a mid-death crisis.

Quote: well, i think he's limiting rights of those who are not christian when he tries to declare laws on things like abortion and gay marrages by his own religion. What i'm trying to say is how can you say that it's a free country which embraces the beliefs of everyone, when everything ends up being chosen by the presidents relgious beliefs on subjects? Kerry said "You can't take away womens rights on abortion because of your own beliefs." We cannot make everyone believe the same thing therefore who is one man to say you cannot because his religion states it as a sin?

I repeat what I said earlier:

Quote: Perhaps you don't realize, but it's pretty much not possible to decide on social issues without bringing your religion into things. That's why I think the president should have no say over social issues. Makes them look like less of an ass, and it makes them do the job they should be doing

Quote: 'm neither gay nor christian, and thankfully never had to decide on abortion issues for myself personally for that matter, but these issues are important to me because i know people who have to deal with them every day or are fitted into these categories- and even if i didn't- who am i to say what they in their free country can and cannot do? I'd feel much better knowing that i lived in a country that not only accepted gay unions between people, but realized that it's our modern culture.

Excluding rape, incest, etc, On the abortion thing: So you're saying you shouldn't have to face up to the consequences of your own decisions? If it's in a case like rape, incest, etc, hell, I'm for abortion. However, it's your own fault for having the child in other cases. The child is a living being, believe it or not. What about the rights of the unborn? At 3 weeks, a baby has it's own brain waves and heart beat. There are laws against aborting a dog's puppies, so why is it that unborn puppies get more rights than human unborn?

Quote: that war was about oil plan and simple. now the friggin idiot Jr. had a yearning to clean up after pops, so of to iraq we go. but the problem is he is borderline retarded and has zero tactial intelligence - so the end result thousands of soldiers are dying in a war they shouldn't even be fighting.

So let me get this straight... if the war was about oil, how the hell have gas and oil prices risen in the US? Nobody would bother with an extremely expensive business venture. I also question you about his tactical intelligence. Kerry had the exact same info as Bush did when Bush invaded Iraq. We completely destroyed Saddam's official forces, and it's been his guerillas and insurgents that have been his main defence. Can you really forsee guerillas and insurgents all that well? No.

And don't give me that crap about soldiers dying. They chose to be in the army, and so they're fighting. I have a friend in the military who WANTS to go to Iraq. The only thing I would care about is civilian deaths, if I were you.

Quote: the threat is bin Laden and guess what? he planning something else. oh right he's hangin out in Afghanistan.

Believe what you like, Bin Laden is currently not a threat. In his last video, he stated that he was planning to choke America's economy. The only possible thing he could even think of trying is trying to take over our foreign oil resources.

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Nov 06, 2004
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belmikry Retired Moderator belly-button

and about the rabortion part

i'm not going to get into that in detail, because it's such a sensitive subject... but just to reply on that...

Why should a woman be forced to carry a child that she does not wish to have, who will be ultimately thrown into a shelter house or adoption agency, where we are already over-condensed, where the child will then either be one of the lucky ones and recieve proper care (hey, my cousin's adopted- love him to bits... nothing wrong with that) but the fact remains is that our world is over populated as it is... in order for the world to have everyone with the same luxuries as you and me, we'd have to only have an overall population of 2 billion. We are 3 times for that, and by 2050- over 12 billion people... wanna talk about exponential growth? there it is... the thing is, it's hard for someone to say you can't do that, being that every situation is different. What if their was complications and if the women was to deliver a baby, she'd die? or possibly she has AIDS or many other STD's which could infect the child- is it your right to say that the child should come to life only to die?

alot of people have many passionate opinions on abortion, thats why it will never we answered properly... we spend too much time judging it as either morally wrong or right, instead of defining what exactly abortion consists of and what it is?

okay... AGAIN.,...

Quote: Perhaps you don't realize, but it's pretty much not possible to decide on social issues without bringing your religion into things. That's why I think the president should have no say over social issues. Makes them look like less of an ass, and it makes them do the job they should be doing

yeah, it's hard, thats why you can't please everyone, and thats again why you can't let your own religion make decisions for the masses... every war ever recorded has something to do with religion in some form- maybe it's about time we realize this as a problem and try to have religious neutrality when it comes to wars? *lol* like that would happen...

Quote: if the war was about oil, how the hell have gas and oil prices risen in the US?

oil prices have risen because we are importing from other countries, because the US is bone dry. Our oil and gas peaked in 1972!!! 1972- and it can't go up after that- face the facts, we are screwed when it comes to oil and gas. We've had over 30 years to switch to alternative fuel resources, but they have not been accepted because it costs more to do this then to import from other countries. The middle East is the Oil countries of the world. This is why were over there- trying to take what we think is ours instead of trying to figure out what to do now. No politician, Bush or Kerry for that matter, will ever deal with this issue. The only president to ever stand up to it was Jimmy Carter when he said to the people, "We have to learn to live with less" ... what did we fine north americans think of that? no way! 0_0 ... instead of going on about how Bush is so good of a president, why dont you look into why he's out there in the first place?

Quote: And don't give me that crap about soldiers dying. They chose to be in the army, and so they're fighting. I have a friend in the military who wants to go to Iraq. The only thing I would care about is civilian deaths, if I were you.

thats right... i hope your friend has fun killing the innocent over something like this... i'm glad for him that he gets the chance to... 0_0

and yeah, i care about civilian deaths- here and in Iraq! thats why i don't support Bush's war on terror!

Quote: Believe what you like, Bin Laden is currently not a threat. In his last video, he stated that he was planning to choke America's economy. The only possible thing he could even think of trying is trying to take over our foreign oil resources.

EXACTLY the point. If Bin Laden takes over the oil resources- that's how he's going to make an impact.... ugh.... 0_0

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Nov 06, 2004
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DREAM Lord of Dreams

Quote by Vagrant123
Quote:
So let me get this straight... if the war was about oil, how the hell
have gas and oil prices risen in the US? Nobody would bother with an
extremely expensive business venture. I also question you about his
tactical intelligence. Kerry had the exact same info as Bush did when
Bush invaded Iraq. We completely destroyed Saddam's official forces,
and it's been his guerillas and insurgents that have been his main
defence. Can you really forsee guerillas and insurgents all that well?
No.
And don't give me that crap about soldiers dying. They chose to be in
the army, and so they're fighting. I have a friend in the military who
WANTS to go to Iraq. The only thing I would care about is
civilian deaths, if I were you.

Quote: the threat is bin Laden and guess what? he planning something
else. oh right he's hangin out in Afghanistan.

Believe what you like, Bin Laden is currently not a threat. In his last
video, he stated that he was planning to choke America's economy. The
only possible thing he could even think of trying is trying to take
over our foreign oil resources.

okay where do i begin? Vagrant123 you need to get your head out your ass and think things through. i will touch on a couple of points- OIL. the prices are skyhigh do to several current events. uncertainity and terrorism in Iraq, Putin's moves against Yukos - the biggest Oil company in Russia, and the lack of new oil reserves fro the oil companies. oil that is extracted must be replaced.

are you serious about that war comment? a huge # of soldiers in Iraq are reserves. also do to the lack of adequate soldiers in the Armed Forces these reserves are required to do 2 and 3 shifts. this lack of forces leaves the US open to attack sinces we will be overtended if facing a great threat from somewhere else in the world. say like North Korea.

bin Laden - he wants to bankrupt our economy. through terrorism. 9/11 cost him $500,000 and it cost the US $1,000,000,000. hmmm. quite a return on assets isn't it? attack oil reserves - he couldn't give a rat's ass about oil. he is planning another huge attack in the US.

bin Laden has already won in a matter of speaking. he killed 1,000's of innocent people, American's have lost some of their liberties, soldiers are dying, the US is divided, and we have an idiot president who's making matter worse.

hey Vagrant123 - remember is not like a video game that we all love. there is not start OVER button in real life.

Nov 06, 2004
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belmikry Retired Moderator belly-button

Quote by DREAM
okay where do i begin? Vagrant123 you need to get your head out your
ass and think things through. i will touch on a couple of points- OIL.
the prices are skyhigh do to several current events. uncertainity and
terrorism in Iraq, Putin's moves against Yukos - the biggest Oil
company in Russia, and the lack of new oil reserves fro the oil
companies. oil that is extracted must be replaced.
are you serious about that war comment? a huge # of soldiers in Iraq
are reserves. also do to the lack of adequate soldiers in the Armed
Forces these reserves are required to do 2 and 3 shifts. this lack of
forces leaves the US open to attack sinces we will be overtended if
facing a great threat from somewhere else in the world. say like North
Korea.
bin Laden - he wants to bankrupt our economy. through terrorism. 9/11
cost him $500,000 and it cost the US $1,000,000,000. hmmm. quite a
return on assets isn't it? attack oil reserves - he couldn't give a
rat's ass about oil. he is planning another huge attack in the US. bin
Laden has already won in a matter of speaking. he killed 1,000's of
innocent people, American's have lost some of their liberties, soldiers
are dying, the US is divided, and we have an idiot president who's
making matter worse.
hey Vagrant123 - remember is not like a video game that we all love.
there is not start OVER button in real life.

my thoughts exactly 0_0

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Nov 06, 2004
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Flower

1. Abortion. Someone asked why a woman should carry an unwanted child. Nope, sorry, no dice. It's a human being, its not you're call anymore. You can't discard it like some peice of property. Babies can be born at a record 13 weeks early(TIME Magazine) and still survive as a human being, if there was ever any doubt it was human, there it went right out the door.

2. The first Gulf War. I can't believe someone said this one was about the Saudi's oil. Iraq invaded kuwait. Does that not sink in to you? The US, and the UN decided that wouldn't fly, and they fought Saddam back, and even left him in power, it was purely to get Saddam's army, out of Kuwait. Did we take anyone's oil? No.

3. The United States still has a decent amount of oil in Alaska. Unfortunatly, it's more important to save a few moose, than to keep a steady supply of fuel that the country depends on to operate.

4. North Korea can be dealt with. Even if the US doesn't do anything, China doesn't want to see North Korea do anything stupid either, they'll step in if necesary, and North Korea, being the little dog that it is to China, will back down.

5. We've lost our liberties? I keep hearing that about the Patriot Act, and I can't really see where we did. I've been over the document several times, but the only thing I see, is the ability for greater communication between the intelligence beaureus and pre-emptive strike capabilities. Which happened to have saved the Brooklyn Bridge and much of New York City I might add. Google "Faris" "Brooklyn Bridge" "Patriot Act".

6. Bin Laden doesn't want to bankrupt the US. He wants to destroy it. Are you delusional or something? And they've been planning "big attacks" on the US for quite some time. In fact we've been attacked at home and abroad by Al-Queda before. Nothing's changed in that regard.

7. Whoever thinks that individual US army soldiers go over to Iraq to kill innocent civilians is utterly idiotic.

8. I said it in another thread, I'll say it here. Bin Laden is NOT the threat. You don't think Al-Queda will continue without him? They have the leadership, they have the trained men, they have the capital, they have the willpower. They'll continue. The only way to stop them is to cut them off at the source. The radical fundamentalist islam movement has been festering for decades, and it's only gotten more dangerous with US apathy towards the issue. Democratizing the region is one of the best ways to stop such dangerous thinking. By kicking out the Taliban, letting Afghanistan hold its first free elections ever, in which 40% of the voters were women. And similar elections to be held in Iraq soon. And supporting the underground democratic student's movement in Iran. It's a hopeful trend. One that actually seeks out terrorism at its root, rather than snipping the hedges.

Nov 06, 2004
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leviathanrk

Flower you make some good points however,

1. This is a tricky subject. However abortion was created as a solution to the fact that many young to-be-mothers die given birth, or that their body can't handle given birth. Mostly due to the fact that these women are very young, between the ages 13-17.

2. As far as I know, after vietnam, the U.S. has never used military force to promote justice or peace in the world. I suppose you wouldn't know about the oil companies Bush, the elder founded and the oil contracts Bush arranged during the Gulf war. Of course I currently have no proof of any underhanded business here, but I do find it strange that Bush would concentrate on oil contracts while in the middle of a war with a country with alot of oil reserves. And furthermore, it is not so much the fact that Bush the Elder had fought in the first gulf war. But the fact that his son had continued the war.

3. Very true, but the current Bush have repeated tried to pass leglistation to oil drilling in Alaska, which is gurantee to destroy one of the last remain virgin wilderness in American territories. Please keep in mind the the entire Bush adminstation all have ties to major oil companies.

4. It's very true that China has considerable influence over N. Korea. However, it is also true that China is one of the most hostile world powers towards America, as well as the fact that China is not democratic, but rather communist, like its neighbor N. Korea. If you had read a little history, you would have known that China had Allied with N. Korea during the N. Korea war against American. China care diddly squat about America, Europe, Democracy, Liberty and human freedom. China never did, and China never will. It only cares about it's self, and if supporting N. Korea is beneficial to China, China will support N. Korea. Do you really consider China an ally to the U.S.?

5. The Patriot Act gives the goverment legal right to ignore the privacy and personal properity of ALL citizens and non-citizens in America. The Patriot act also curtails on the Freedom of Speech, meaning that we, as American citizens no longer have a right to say somethings about the government, weather it is true or not. The patriot any also made some types of political protest illegal. Granted, it is easier for the government to fight terroist when it's citizens have less rights, but the patriot act infringes on our consititution right of free speech and a citizen right to private property granted to us by the bill of rights, which was designed, in the first place to allow the citizens to speak out against their government.

6. Osama Bid Laden, has repeated said to destroy America, one has to destroy American economy; this as reported by American, as well as foreign media. Clinton didn't think Bid Laden would have follow through and strike WTC either.

7. You are right that no U.S. soldier joins the army to kill innocent Civilians. However the soldiers have to follow orders from the Command-in-chief, who seems to have no problems murdering innocent Civilians.

8. "Saddam Hussein didn't kill 3,100 people on Sept. 11. Osama bin Laden did, and as far as we know he's still alive."
- William J. Clinton

;-)

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed."
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

- R. K. Kishore

Nov 07, 2004
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DREAM Lord of Dreams

Quote by Flower1. Abortion. Someone asked why a woman should carry an unwanted child.
Nope, sorry, no dice. It's a human being, its not you're call anymore.
You can't discard it like some peice of property. Babies can be born at
a record 13 weeks early(TIME Magazine) and still survive as a human
being, if there was ever any doubt it was human, there it went right
out the door.
2. The first Gulf War. I can't believe someone said this one was about
the Saudi's oil. Iraq invaded kuwait. Does that not sink in to you? The
US, and the UN decided that wouldn't fly, and they fought Saddam back,
and even left him in power, it was purely to get Saddam's army, out of
Kuwait. Did we take anyone's oil? No.
3. The United States still has a decent amount of oil in Alaska.
Unfortunatly, it's more important to save a few moose, than to keep a
steady supply of fuel that the country depends on to operate.
4. North Korea can be dealt with. Even if the US doesn't do anything,
China doesn't want to see North Korea do anything stupid either,
they'll step in if necesary, and North Korea, being the little dog that
it is to China, will back down. 5. We've lost our liberties? I keep
hearing that about the Patriot Act, and I can't really see where we
did. I've been over the document several times, but the only thing I
see, is the ability for greater communication between the intelligence
beaureus and pre-emptive strike capabilities. Which happened to have
saved the Brooklyn Bridge and much of New York City I might add. Google
"Faris" "Brooklyn Bridge" "Patriot Act".
6. Bin Laden doesn't want to bankrupt the US. He wants to destroy it.
Are you delusional or something? And they've been planning "big
attacks" on the US for quite some time. In fact we've been attacked at
home and abroad by Al-Queda before. Nothing's changed in that regard.
7. Whoever thinks that individual US army soldiers go over to Iraq to
kill innocent civilians is utterly idiotic.
8. I said it in another thread, I'll say it here. Bin Laden is NOT the
threat. You don't think Al-Queda will continue without him? They have
the leadership, they have the trained men, they have the capital, they
have the willpower. They'll continue. The only way to stop them is to
cut them off at the source. The radical fundamentalist islam movement
has been festering for decades, and it's only gotten more dangerous
with US apathy towards the issue. Democratizing the region is one of
the best ways to stop such dangerous thinking. By kicking out the
Taliban, letting Afghanistan hold its first free elections ever, in
which 40% of the voters were women. And similar elections to be held in
Iraq soon. And supporting the underground democratic student's movement
in Iran. It's a hopeful trend. One that actually seeks out terrorism at
its root, rather than snipping the hedges.

here's my response,

1) i agree for the most part. i don't condone abortion unless: the female was raped, incest, or her life is in jeopardy.

2) that some1 is me. know that the gulf war was about oil. plain and simple. this dates back to Eisenhower. he had an agreement with the then king of Saudi Arabia, King Abdul Aziz. The agreement SA promised that the oil would flow and the US offered protection. enter Sadamn Hussein in the 90's. he was sitting on arguably the greatest volume of untapped oil reserves (outside of Russia). he eyed Saudi Arabia like a hyena eyes a rabbit. :nya: sounds like a sound miltiary stategy right? Sadamn forgot 1 thing. the US. Bush Sr. went in there since his true masters were in jeopardy. this wasn't a humanitarian effort; no it was simply about OIL.

3) you are overestimating Alaskian reserves. although large they cannot fully satisfy US consumption.

4) NK will only step down if a country tells them: hey knock off the bs or we will siphon off investments and increase the tarriffs by a factor of 10X. i guarantee they would step off. but Bush Jr. probably won't do this. why? hmm i wonder.

5) you don't see how we lost our liberties? are you 4 real? ever taken a plane ride? i don't know about you- but i don't own a $50 milliion Gulfstream jet. i have to stand in line with every1 else. guess what you and I will probably be stripped searched and the asshole next to us with the c4 in his walkman will board the aircraft with np. the military (special forces generally) test the security of airports all the time. funny thing is they almost always get the weapons on the plane. my advice use the full body scanners that were used in total recall. they exist.

6) yes, when i say Bin Laden- i mean the whole Al Queda network as well. Bin Laden planned the 9/11 attack for over 5 years. he's patient, has extraordinary financial resources ($250 million + net worth) his network is very impentrable. he is absolutely planning another attack. the only ? is when and where.

7) i agree.

8) wrong. Bin Laden masterminded and ordered his people to kill 3,100 innocent people. Sadamn Hussein killed some of his own people but went after Saudi Arabia. all your talk of Afghanistan is highly misguided. oh wow they can vote. :angry: guess what the US attacks on Bin Laden have ceased. so he's allowed to formulate another attack on US soil. or perhaps you heard about all the poppy seeds? yeah the drugs are flowing quite well over there. in fact i go so far as say the country is run by warlords; like Somalia - opps that's another story.

is it me or is any1 else totally digusted by this direction Bush and the adminstration has taken?

Nov 07, 2004
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Flower

2. So you choose to see an oil conspiracy where the UN and the US saw a war to push back Iraqi troops. I guess if that's the way you see it, I can't convince you otherwise. Saddam wasn't eyeing the Saudi's oil, he was looking at Kuwait's, he thought he had a legitimate claim to it, and believed the international community wouldn't be bothered in stopping him. Guess he was wrong.

3. I never said it would be enough to sustain us, but it's there, and it can be used.

4. Uhh, mayhaps you don't understand the nature of the sanctions placed on North Korea at present? Not to mention I hear all this bonanza from the left about how the sanctions are killing innocent North Korean children. Bush is looking for multilateral talks that involve North Korea and China, the smartest move he could make. If he involves China, North Korea will HAVE to stick to their end of the bargain. We don't invest in North Korea, almost no one does, there's nothing to invest in.

5. Oh noes! They're checking my bags! I've always been subjected to searches, before and after 9/11. Now I just have to take off my shoes, oh noes! What a travesty! You have to wait in line? The horror! You're really reaching here.

8. He did NOT mastermind jack. I don't even think you know what's going on. Khalid Muhammed planned the attack. If you believe Osama is anything more than a figurehead, an image, you're deluding yourself. Sadam never went after Saudi Arabia. My talk of Afghanistan is "misguided"? How so? Voting is a fundamental part of freedom. It's a right in America, but its a privilege in Afghanistan, one they've never had before, and now the fate of Aghanistan lies in the hands of the Afghan people. Oh no! The US attacks against Al-Queda have not ceased, just because you don't hear about it on the media, doesn't mean they aren't happening. The US is working very closely with a former "enemy" Pakistan, and have been quite successful and bringing down major leaders of the Al-Queda organization, including the mastermind of 9/11, Khalid Muhammed.

And what's wrong with drugs? I'm a social libertarian, I don't think the government has any business regulating what you can or cannot do in your private life, so while I don't personally condone the use of such substances, I think it's a personal decision. Go ahead, shoot heroine, I don't care, but impede on another's rights, and then you get shafted.

Somalia, we tried there, but 18 US casualties were too much for Clinton and the US people. So we cut and ran. America simply doesn't have the man power to take on every dictatorship in the world. The rest of the world has to accept the responsbility in seeing that every country has basic human rights, like being able to voice an opinion without getting raped or thrown into a plastic shredder.

Nov 07, 2004
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Vagrant123 I'm having a mid-death crisis.

Quote: oil prices have risen because we are importing from other countries, because the US is bone dry. Our oil and gas peaked in 1972!!! 1972- and it can't go up after that- face the facts, we are screwed when it comes to oil and gas.

Face the facts -- Gas prices have nearly doubled in California in the last few years. I doubt the war was for oil.

Quote: thats right... i hope your friend has fun killing the innocent over something like this... i'm glad for him that he gets the chance to... 0_0

WTH? When did I say he wanted to kill the innocent?

Quote: EXACTLY the point. If Bin Laden takes over the oil resources- that's how he's going to make an impact.... ugh.... 0_0

We have backup oil areas. It's called Alaska and Canada. And in case you haven't noticed, most of Bin Ladne's forces are dead.

Quote: okay where do i begin? Vagrant123 you need to get your head out your ass and think things through.

You know, it's nice to get my head out of my ass and into the meth houses. *wink*

Quote: a huge # of soldiers in Iraq are reserves. also do to the lack of adequate soldiers in the Armed Forces these reserves are required to do 2 and 3 shifts. this lack of forces leaves the US open to attack sinces we will be overtended if facing a great threat from somewhere else in the world. say like North Korea.

The reserves still chose to join, like it or not.

North Korea is being handled by Southern Korea currently. So far, the situation is defusing.

Quote: bin Laden - he wants to bankrupt our economy. through terrorism. 9/11 cost him $500,000 and it cost the US $1,000,000,000. hmmm. quite a return on assets isn't it?

Where did you pull those numbers? Please, tell me.

Quote: hey Vagrant123 - remember is not like a video game that we all love. there is not start OVER button in real life.

I enjoy the hate mucho, thanks. :\

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Nov 07, 2004
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leviathanrk

Quote:
Quote: bin Laden - he wants to bankrupt our economy. through terrorism. 9/11 cost him $500,000 and it cost the US $1,000,000,000. hmmm. quite a return on assets isn't it?

Where did you pull those numbers? Please, tell me.

The cost of restoring WTC is atleast another $11,000,000,000.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=271674&messageid=1075516513

Quote:
2. So you choose to see an oil conspiracy where the UN and the US saw a war to push back Iraqi troops. I guess if that's the way you see it, I can't convince you otherwise. Saddam wasn't eyeing the Saudi's oil, he was looking at Kuwait's, he thought he had a legitimate claim to it, and believed the international community wouldn't be bothered in stopping him. Guess he was wrong.

It is true that sadam did invade Kuwait for Oil, however Bush also did the same, he fought iraq for Oil.
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/030703_us_intentions.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:OPEC

Quote: 4. Uhh, mayhaps you don't understand the nature of the sanctions placed on North Korea at present? Not to mention I hear all this bonanza from the left about how the sanctions are killing innocent North Korean children. Bush is looking for multilateral talks that involve North Korea and China, the smartest move he could make. If he involves China, North Korea will HAVE to stick to their end of the bargain. We don't invest in North Korea, almost no one does, there's nothing to invest in.

I'm not sure you read my previous post, cause it sure doesn't seem that you did. But let me write it agin, N. Korea is communist, China is communist. When the U.S. fought and defeated N. Korean in the Korean War, IT WAS THE CHINESE that allied with N. Korean and fought back with the U.S. What exactly makes you think the Chinese are going listen to America.

http://www.fsmitha.com/h2/ch24kor.html

Example of American savage Roman-like-imperilism and murder of innocent civilians, mostly likely at the hands of its commanders, a quote from the link above:

'The Air Force was after military targets, but distinction between military targets and civilians was blurred and was recognized as such by Air Force commanders.

The U.S. Navy joined in the overkill by attacking North Korean fishing vessels, crippling this source of food for the Koreans. General Curtis LeMay, of Tokyo firebombing fame, agreed with the Air Force's plan to flatten North Korea's cities, and in retirement was to describe the U.S. as having "burned down every town in North Korea."'

Quote: 5. Oh noes! They're checking my bags! I've always been subjected to searches, before and after 9/11. Now I just have to take off my shoes, oh noes! What a travesty! You have to wait in line? The horror! You're really reaching here.

I'm glad you're finding the Patriot Act funny Flower, however I do not see anything funny about violation of my constitutional freedom.
http://www.gunowners.org/patriotii.htm
http://www.amconmag.com/05_19_03/cover.html

"Since September 11th, over 2,000 people, including many U.S. citizens, have been imprisoned by the FBI and police in the name of "fighting terrorism." Only two of them have been charged with a crime associated with 9/11. Many say they have been denied food and sleep, access to an attorney, and have even been beaten. The FBI has even called for legalizing torture of such "suspects.""
http://www.isil.org/resources/lit/dictatorship-at-doorstep.html

If the United Nations once admits that international disputes can be settled by using force, then we will have destroyed the foundation of the organization and our best hope of establishing a world order.
Dwight D. Eisenhower

- R. K. Kishore

Nov 08, 2004
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belmikry Retired Moderator belly-button

Quote by DREAM\is it me or is any1
else totally digusted by this direction Bush and the adminstration has
taken?

and how -_- ....

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Anime wallpaper/Female Scans/Group Scans Moderator - rippers and duplicates beware of belly's button! XD [ermmm... o_o]

Nov 08, 2004
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leviathanrk

FYI: Canadian privacy is also threated by the patriot Act ;-)

http://www.epic.org/privacy/terrorism/usapatriot/
"Report: USA patriot Act Threatens Canadians' Privacy. British Columbia's Information and Privacy Commissioner has released a report (pdf) finding that the USA patriot Act violates British Columbian privacy laws, and that personal information about Canadians may be accessible to the U.S. government under the Act. The report concludes that changes to privacy law and other measures are necessary to protect British Columbians' personal information against seizure under the controversial American law. (Nov. 1, 2004)"

- R. K. Kishore

Nov 08, 2004
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DREAM Lord of Dreams

Where did you pull those numbers? Please, tell me.

These numbers were just an estimation, and unfortunately a very bad
estimation. The total cost of the Damage Bin Laden did due to bombing
WTC is more than $105,000,000,000.
http://www.newyorkmetro.com/news/articles/wtc/1year/numbers.htm
The cost of restoring WTC is atleast another $11,000,000,000.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=271674&messageid=1075516513

Quote:

i got the numbers from cnn.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/01/binladen.tape/index.html

don't forget the damage Washington D.C. took and business lost by businesses and consumers. like airlines, etc.

Nov 08, 2004
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MooMooMooCow Beef

mmm i wonder wat it would be like if it was Christian Extremist mmmmmmmmmm

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Take the clouds from your eyes and see me as I really am - Don Quixote

Nov 08, 2004
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DREAM Lord of Dreams

Quote by MooMooMooCowmmm i wonder wat it would be like if it was Christian Extremist mmmmmmmmmm

um- if what was MooMooMooCow?.

btw-i love chesseburgers. :)
yummy

Nov 08, 2004
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leviathanrk

Quote by MooMooMooCowmmm i wonder wat it would be like if it was Christian Extremist mmmmmmmmmm

I would assume the nation would feel the same way. However Christian Extremist most probably will come from the U.S. rather than abroad; so what we'll probably end up with is laws much worse the the Patriot Act.

- R. K. Kishore

Nov 08, 2004
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DREAM Lord of Dreams

Quote by leviathanrk
Quote by MooMooMooCowmmm i wonder wat it would be like if it was Christian Extremist mmmmmmmmmm

I would assume the nation would feel the same way. However Christian Extremist most probably will come from the U.S. rather than abroad; so what we'll probably end up with is laws much worse the the Patriot Act.

hey, who knows with a little luck the US can become a military state. like Beruit or some other foreign paradise. :hmpf:
hey Dreams can come true.

Bush = ?

"i am Dream and I approve this message"

Nov 08, 2004
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Ilona

I have never thougth that doing something wrong was better than doing nothing... well I guess it depends.

OK, since I don't know know the american presidents, can you just tell me one who has taken his country in a war for false pretenses ? No WMD, no links with al-Qaeda... yes Saddam Hussein was bad but so are lot of other dicators that don't have oil, luckily for them... or maybe they have some wmd. It's nice to jump to this explanations when all the main accusations were prooven to be lies.

He's without any doubt one of the most umpopular american president for the whole world. I think it's a big achievement considering that just after 9/11 most of the world was sad for the USA.

But Guantanamo, denying people some rigths, isn't that a joke from a country that pretend to defend liberties ? Abu Graib, isn't that sick to explain that what Hussein done was worst ? (so now some dictators are just the model that set the limit ?)

well now the civilians of Fallujah...

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Nov 09, 2004
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Vagrant123 I'm having a mid-death crisis.

Quote: I don't know know the american presidents, can you just tell me one who has taken his country in a war for false pretenses ?

I don't know many presidents either, but I do know rather unsuccessful wars, or wars that we nearly lost. (War of 1812, and the Vietnam War[Don't forget the civil war as well, different issues though])

Quote: He's without any doubt one of the most umpopular american president for the whole world

Because up until the 20th century, nobody really said anything about America because we were isolationist. There are so many forgotten presidents, it's absurd.

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"I'm stuck on bandages because bandages are stuck on me."

http://forums.xgenstudios.com

Nov 10, 2004
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