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Origins / Causes of homosexuality or bisexuality?

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unicorn2006

Retired Moderator

unicorn2006

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There are different theories as to why homosexuality/bisexuality exist. If you can't acknowledge this fact, please don't post and go away. >.>

Nature:
Some argue that it is biologically determined, and there's nothing that can be done to prevent that individual from becoming homosexual/bisexual. If humans are part of the evolutionary process, and homosexuals obviously cannot partake in producing offspring and in evolution, why does homosexuality exist? Could it be a commonly occurring genetic mutation?

Btw, is this position beneficial to the gay rights advocacy campaigns? (I ask because some people say that activists who support this side of the argument are actually hurting their campaign)

Nurture:
Others argue that it is due to various external social/cultural factors, and that these people could have been heterosexual, or that they can change back to being straight, or that homosexuality/bisexuality could have been 'prevented'. Then, are homosexuals/bisexuals mistaken in their sexual identity? Do you think it's possible to 'convert' them to heterosexuality?

Nature & Nurture:
There are other theories that combine the two sides of the nature vs. nurture debate on human sexuality.

So, where do you think homosexuality or bisexuality comes from? Feel free to bash any theory - just don't place value judgments on homosexuals and/or bisexuals.

"Faith means believing in something that will only make sense in reverse."
"When men are the most sure and arrogant they are commonly the most mistaken..."

DarkSavior

DarkSavior

~Death's Adversary~

I'm not as deep with words but I'll keep it simple...

I believe that it is by choice because how can someone say you are born gay... I have a friend that is gay that said he is born gay though... I'm guessing most of them think their born gay... but I can't assume that too because of the one gay guy I know. I think I know another but he's hiding in the closet... Found alot of gay porn on his computer. Bottom line... I still believe it's by choice...

I'd rather be hated for who I am rather than loved for who I pretend to be...

i dont know really...i think its a nurturing thing...as we r young...we grow up seeing things and learn from it...it think its all television
EXAMPLE: Bert and Bernie from Sesame Street...two guys living in the same roof and share lots of things together
umm...super heroes in tights

life is but a dream...
my soul belongs to meli-chan

happygreendragonfly

happygreendragonfly

The Cheerful Person

Nature:
Well, my human sexuality professor stated that while the embryo is in utero there are two testosterone washes/floods for the embryo to be a straight male. And if the second testosterone wash does not happen, then the embryo will/ might be gay or bisexual. This is only pertaining to males. I don't know about the females, she didn't talk about it. (**Now, I might be wrong in some areas because I only remember bits and pieces, here and there. This information is what I learned last Spring. I must be getting old if I'm second-guessing myself!**)

Nuture:
Again, this is what I learned in class... My cultural anthropology professor stated that there are some tribal practices in some areas of the world practice homosexuality. Well, anyways, this tribe believed that females are born perfect and the males are imperfect. They believed that males came into the world without semen, so in order to obtain semen the males have to get it from other males. This is usually done by young boys getting semen from young men. I think this goes on about a few months to a year, maybe. Anyways, after the young boys grow up they are happily married heterosexuals. (**Don't ask me which of the world, I don't remember. I'm horrible.**)

My opinion is that homosexuality/ bisexuality can indeed be both nature and nuture. Because I knew some guys who chose to be gay and some guys who are attracted and like men in general. So, my opinion it might as well be both. I always think there's two sides to everything. This is no exception.

BTW, I'm straight... is that relevent?!

Or don't pay attention to my post. Afterall, I'm just a silly girl.

It's likely part of the human instinct to explore the unknown side of ourselves and our environment. Generally, most of my homosexual friends are the type to question a lot of things and generally love doing things they don't normally get to do, so it may simply be an extension of this.

Devildude

Devildude

- Alstroemeria Records -

I think it is a part of nature, and nurture at the same time.
ppl can be born gay, it is nature, some thinking can flourish in the minds, depending on how you think of it. It can be done.

Nurture, imagine if you grow up in a society where things like this is considered normal, naturally, people tend to be shaped that way. It is something that happens consider the environment to it.

Enough with the cliche, i drop my view, it happens at times because of oneself. I had a friend who goes gay because he is struck by sadness of his girlfriend leaving him. And he has found happiness in a gay relationship more than anyone ever does, he is now the house(wife) of a married gay couple for 4 years (they started early actually before the legalization of married gays) by now, and he is consioderably happy. I dare say, sometimes, it is caused by certain situations and conditions being met. The origins are not sure, but sometimes, the origin is self situation. Meeting up with something emotional and so on can cause the difference.

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The wind of destiny blows, and the descendant shall walk the earth once more...

I have never met anyone who is gay who has told me that they chose to be that way. I think most bi sexuals were sexually abused as children or just have an addiction to sex....most of the bi people ive met anyways....the other bi people that i know, have told me that they are confused as to which gender they are attracted to emotionally, and which one they are attracted to sexually.
just putting in my personal experience there...

sadotsu

sadotsu

Neko-sama

I think the nature+nurture thing is quite logical... some are born with it, and some grow into it.

Brownie the Cat

Isnt the nurture theory used for pedophiles though? It seems that the theory is used for a lot of things: homosexuality, pedophilia, cannibalism, rapists, murderers, etc....

only one of those doesnt seem to be a majorly bad thing either...:(

That's just it, there can't simply be one cause. It's something that happens because of many reasons be it experiences growing up, perspectives on the world and its people, interactions with people or simply uncontrollable emotions. Asking why some people are homosexual, bisexual or anything in between is the same as asking someone why they are or why they fall in love. There doesn't have to be a reason, it just happens.

nahh.
there is a reason for sure, but the point is that homosexuals wont know the reason for why they are what they are themselfe...
They just feel attracted to the wrong gender for some reason and since they cannot have childrens, it isnt in our DNA or it is somehow in everyones DNA so that the evolution cant do anything against it and just anyone has the "potential" to be homosexual while it doesnt differ from guy to guy.
So it must somehow come due to some kind of social influences from their surroundings.
But to make studies and experiments with humans is allways a longlasting and complicated and to some extend forbidden thing, so i guess it will be hard to look for the reasons and social factors that make people homosexual.

www.animeph.com

has anyone seen the research on the x and y chormosomes....i think they said that homosexuals have more of the one than the other, but not enough of that same one to be for example a female...
not sure if they are still studying this or not

As a homosexual man, I find some of the things here to be a little offensive but at least you are addressing your views on the matter. And that really helps people like me to understand more of what goes through the mind of a heterosexual person when dealing wiht homosexuality as an issue.
One of you mentioned television as being an influence. Kinda hard don't you think? Here in Singapore, the slightest hint of homosexual content is frowned upon and therefore will most likely be censored if the show is not banned totally.
Nurture is possible, but you have to realise that I do have friends who grew up surrounded by girls and yet are still heterosexuals themselves, albeit the fact that they seem to know more about make up and other related topics than I do.
For myself, I never CHOSE to BE gay. I just knew it. I knew that I was attracted to other boys at quite a young age. And I still remember how I hated myself for being gay, and how every night I prayed to God to take my life since I felt so dirty so disgusting for liking boys. I asked him to take it out of me and if he would not to then please take my life, so I would no be a mar in society.
I still remember the pain I went through in trying to BE straight. I even deluded myself that it was a phase I was going through when I was in my teens. I even deluded myself that I was in love with a girl. But I never was in love with her, I realise that now. And thakfully, I never went stady with her.
For it would have been very unfair to her, let alone to anyone. I don't really know what the readers might get from this, but this is my life experience, and I hope that you would have learnt that homosexuality is not something that can be chosen like choosing a path in life.

Quote by daemon71 As a homosexual man, I find some of the things here to be a little offensive but at least you are addressing your views on the matter. And that really helps people like me to understand more of what goes through the mind of a heterosexual person when dealing wiht homosexuality as an issue.
One of you mentioned television as being an influence. Kinda hard don't you think? Here in Singapore, the slightest hint of homosexual content is frowned upon and therefore will most likely be censored if the show is not banned totally.
Nurture is possible, but you have to realise that I do have friends who grew up surrounded by girls and yet are still heterosexuals themselves, albeit the fact that they seem to know more about make up and other related topics than I do.
For myself, I never CHOSE to BE gay. I just knew it. I knew that I was attracted to other boys at quite a young age. And I still remember how I hated myself for being gay, and how every night I prayed to God to take my life since I felt so dirty so disgusting for liking boys. I asked him to take it out of me and if he would not to then please take my life, so I would no be a mar in society.
I still remember the pain I went through in trying to BE straight. I even deluded myself that it was a phase I was going through when I was in my teens. I even deluded myself that I was in love with a girl. But I never was in love with her, I realise that now. And thakfully, I never went stady with her.
For it would have been very unfair to her, let alone to anyone. I don't really know what the readers might get from this, but this is my life experience, and I hope that you would have learnt that homosexuality is not something that can be chosen like choosing a path in life.

I understand fully, and I'm sorry to hear about what you had to go through. For one thing, God chose who we are now. No man has any right to change us, let alone even try. That is to say, whatever God gives us, we are to consider it as a gift than a curse. In fact, I have nothing against homosexuals .... I would like to have one as a friend, in fact.

That being said, I think homosexuals / others ... are like that from birth. Genetic mysteries some of us (even me) don't understand ... Agh. ><

I have to say though, that once homosexual, no one can change it, though I remember reading in one book that just because some men have effiminate gestures towards other people doesn't totally mean he's gay ... he just grew up in a nice, loving home. (...or something).

Just some word drabble I decided to post ... hm ...

I can imagine how hard it can be to be a homosexual and a Christian. I'm going steady with my girlfriend, and I love her very much. But then I imagine God telling me that it would be sin to love her, or any other one. Then, you would feel unhappy, because loving another would be a sin, and although loving God is rewarding, I still would not find it as complete.

.. hmmm.. most of you seem to suggest that homosexuality is a choice.. so did everyone that isnt gay choose to be heterosexual?.. cause you make it sound like your preference is that easily changable..

Are there homosexual/bisexual animals?

Because if there isn't, then why are humans the only species on this planet that have this tendency? If evolution is true, and that homosexuality/bisexuality comes from genes, then it has to have come from somewhere. Does it not make homosexuality/bisexuality unnatural then? The Bible clearly says that homosexuality/bisexuality is a sin, and sin originated in man.

There is plenty of scientific EVIDENCE that it is not a nature thing. The homosexual does not contain something in their DNA that is different from the heterosexual.

Just exactly how it happens throughout someone's life - who knows. But, how did it happen throughout my life that my lustful desires would be so strong? I don't know. My marriage suffered through the sin of adultery. I have always had a "roaming eye" with a huge desire for other women (I'm straight). However, God loves me, the adulterer, but He hates my sin of adultery. He has higher standards for me and will help me if I'm willing to see the disgusting acts and consequences of my sexual sins. Therefore, I've sought His forgiveness and He's granted it (because He's that awesome). I have to prove myself every day. I have to pray for strengh every day (I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me). Those past character traits are gone - not literally because I'm still me - but they have no power over me anymore.

Homosexuality is a sin. A sin that God hates. He loves the homosexual, just like He loves the adulterer. But He calls us to a higher standard. And if we honestly seek Him out and ask for help He will provide it. What that looks like for the homosexual individual, not sure exactly, but it is similar to myself. The homosexual must stop acting out their sexual sin and turn to God. Any sin keeps us away from Him. Once you turn He turns.

I would like to add this:

The Ancient Greek men were, and were expected to be, homosexual/bisexual. If you've ever watched the movie Alexander, you would know what I'm talking about. In fact, lesbianism began during the Greek times on the Greek island of Lesbos (hence the term lesbianism).

Don't tell me that the entire civilization suffer from a genetic mutation. But even so, what about their descendants who walk among us today?

Lebianism comes from the Greek Island of Lesbos. That's all I know.

With all the chemicals that get tossed into our bodies now it might be nature thing rearing it's ugly head, but since these activities happened in a few civilizations back in the past that really haven't had that many things to fool around with. Only thing that humanity might consistently take in that did any damage to our systems at all over time is alcohol. How that screws with fetus is already documented (unless someone is leaving out a report or something)

Bad enough that a severely drunken person might mistake another man for a female or something.

THough it's not the easiest thing to do.. but start looking at some cultures. Why do gays pop up more in some places then others? If we're doing this cultural study, it defiantely seems more like a nurture deal. Maybe it's not a perfect idea of what I'm trying to get at but it seems like the more macho-ism there is a civilization the more likely more homosexual men will arrise as to try to balance it.

Just look at the recently emerging stories of gay cowboys and samurais. Some would argue that it is because of the demands placed upon them and how often they are away from others that cause them to go that way. Like all the jokes and stories we hear about sailors being out at sea for too long or prisoners getting like that sooner or later in jail. At that point it's a need of release.

If you looked at shamanism in some places and a few other religious setups there are benefits to violating the gender roles or that sometimes it was just expected of the practicer. Especially some asian shamans were expected to dress, act and have sexual relations as the other gender.

Quote by algadoreoAre there homosexual/bisexual animals?

Because if there isn't, then why are humans the only species on this planet that have this tendency? If evolution is true, and that homosexuality/bisexuality comes from genes, then it has to have come from somewhere. Does it not make homosexuality/bisexuality unnatural then? The Bible clearly says that homosexuality/bisexuality is a sin, and sin originated in man.

In answer to your question, yes, there are recorded cases of homosexuality among animals. There have been instances of homosexual relationships between bees, beetles, birds, fruit bats, sheep, and even orangutans. One in particular happened in New York's Central Park Zoo, where two male penguins have been carrying on a relationship for several years now, participating in traditional pair-bonding behavior while ignoring potential females.

I want to know this - what kind of relationship are the penguins having? Penguins only mate to procreate and then look after their young - but homosexual penguins cannot procreate, so what do they do? Even among humans, some men may be straight, but they choose to ignore potential females as well.

What kinds of behaviour do the other animals you listed show that make them homosexual?

And that still doesn't explain the Greeks though.

Quote by algadoreoI want to know this - what kind of relationship are the penguins having? Penguins only mate to procreate and then look after their young - but homosexual penguins cannot procreate, so what do they do? Even among humans, some men may be straight, but they choose to ignore potential females as well.

What kinds of behaviour do the other animals you listed show that make them homosexual?

I might have been a little vague before, so I'll defer to National Geographic on this one. (Source: "Homosexual Activity Among Animals Stirs Debate" by James Owen. July 23, 2004)

On the penguins:
"Roy and Silo, two male chinstrap penguins at New York's Central Park Zoo have been inseparable for six years now. They display classic pair-bonding behavior--entwining of necks, mutual preening, flipper flapping, and the rest. They also have sex, while ignoring potential female mates."

Filming a documentary:
"The team caught female Japanese macaques engaged in intimate acts which, if observed in humans, would be in the X-rated category."

I could go on, but you get the idea.

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